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Post by midlifecrisisrd on May 15, 2020 13:34:58 GMT 1
Thought I'd better do a thread in here rather than the one that happened in the wanted section lol
Problem is it won't rev out
With tzr race pipes on the power band is 7 - 9 then stops dead
With standard 51l pipes power builds from 5, come on the pipe at 6 but hits a wall at 7
It's a 3hm1 so combined cdi/pv controller
There was talk of possible restriction but God knows
Blurb says 45hp at 9500 so doesn't sound like it should be
Revving in neutral and the pv cover off it starts opening about 6 and fully open over 9
Strange for something designed specifically for the jap market to be set this way if it was restricted
Also not sure if when made in 88 the 40hp limit was in yet
Occasionally it will go to 8 in a lower gear but no power up there
No bogging, no stuttering just stops revving
It has the stupid linked carbs which are a bitch to get on and off but I think they are coming off again lol
Can't remember if I took the balls out ooh, er.
Also not checked what was actually in them or whether it's been buggered about with
Mains should be 155 so I assume 25 pj.
When I got it the tzr pipes were on it, pod filters and 150 mains
After some arsing with fuel levels (reckon the ones I bought were crap) the second set of seats/needles sorted this
I'll update as I go but tried the 250 pipes and as said they top out at 7k
The baffles are like the normal style but the section that is perforated has a solid smaller diameter tube through it so not used. There is a baffle plate half way up the silencer so half the silencer are is unused
They don't sound muffled, just the usual should from an RD with standard pipes
I've put another 3hm cdi on it but no difference
I also wondered if the tacho was slow but as it is between 9 and 10k till the pv's are fully open it looks ok.
I've just ordered an ignitech today for my other build so can always temp wire that in to check for cdi restriction
Also Jonw is sorting me separate carbs but they will understandably take time
I'll get the ungrateful bitch running one way or another lol
It's just annoying it runs perfect up to 7k
Next step is trying standard 1ua pipes
Steve
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Post by hoist1 on May 15, 2020 13:47:03 GMT 1
Baffle plate sounds weird. But Yamaha must know what they’re doing, got to be to restrict it.
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Post by midlifecrisisrd on May 15, 2020 13:55:30 GMT 1
Baffle plate sounds weird. It is Just checked with jonw and his are different The 51l model has baffles with a 51l part number that don't have the solid pipe through the middle of the perforated tube The 3hm1 and 1xg list a 1kt part number so they are different Think I may just cut the feckin tube and see what happens lol Nah, I'll try the 1ua's first Steve |
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Post by hoist1 on May 15, 2020 14:36:15 GMT 1
The Swiss were the most draconian for power limits I think. Silly question, the throttle slides do open fully?
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Post by hoist1 on May 15, 2020 14:47:52 GMT 1
Oh, and have you got a boroscope? I know you don’t want to cut them but can’t imagine anyone would want a restricted bike. You wouldn’t think Piper 3 into 1 would work but they do, sort of.
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Post by midlifecrisisrd on May 15, 2020 15:21:17 GMT 1
Yes carbs open fully
They are the linked type so push/pull cables and mechanically liked to the slides
I have a bore scope but I've looked up the pipes with a torch and there is very little carbon in them
I've used the 250 front pipes on a 350 and it revved to 9 easily
Steve
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Post by LC_BOTT on May 15, 2020 15:30:37 GMT 1
Can you run it with the PV's wedged fully open, and do you have the original carb settings for a standard bike?
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Post by midlifecrisisrd on May 15, 2020 16:30:49 GMT 1
Can you run it with the PV's wedged fully open, and do you have the original carb settings for a standard bike? Could do, easy enough to hit the kill switch, switch off the ignition then pull the pv fuse Carbs are the correct model with correct 22.5 pilot and 155 mains No way of checking the power jets as they are fixed but supposed to be the standard 25's The pj being 25 makes sense of the 350r using a 25 pj instead of 55 like the 1ua with Yamaha and reusing the parts bin Steve |
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Post by midlifecrisisrd on May 15, 2020 16:42:55 GMT 1
Forum member 17 again kindly took his 3hm1 out today to do a comparison
Exactly the same JDM bike, exact same standatd spec and his starts pulling from 6k like this one
The difference is his revs to 9.5k and even 10 if held open
Carbs off again lol
Steve
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Post by midlifecrisisrd on May 19, 2020 14:26:35 GMT 1
May be a red herring but took the oil pump cover off as I was going to disconnect the cable to swap out for an f1 cable ready for the "normal" carbs when they get here
Noticed that on full throttle the pump was not aligned with the long mark on the pulley
I'm sure I set it that way when I built it up
Also with the throttle on full I can't turn the pulley any more so it's sticking and not turning fully
I've got the cable off now but it looks like the return spring has been trapped between the pulley and the pump body so the pulley jams and won't turned
I'm now wondering if this has been happening and stopping the carbs opening fully 🤔
Need to get the pump cable back on and see if the pulley lines up now 🤞
Steve
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Post by midlifecrisisrd on May 19, 2020 19:28:42 GMT 1
Just popped out and removed the oil pump, popped the spring out and let it rest where it ended up
Then gave it the one third turn to locate it in the pulley
Refitted pump and fitted the cable without changing any adjustments
Twisted the grip to the stop and now instead of the alignment being a good 5 or 6 mm short it now goes round to the long mark
So in theory if the pump wasn't opening the last 6mm then the carbs wouldn't be any where near open
The pulley on the carb mechanism is a bigger diameter than the oil pump pulley which would suggest the carbs are even shorter on their stroke
Also that probably means the power jet hasn't been coming into play so double whammy
Time will tell, I'll give it a test run in the morning and see if this sorts it
Steve
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Post by midlifecrisisrd on May 19, 2020 20:52:37 GMT 1
Couldn't wait so took it out
First twice I tried to rev it out it stuttered a bit then fouled the right plug
Third attempt and it clears it's throat and revs right through to 9k in the lower gears
In high gears it pulls strong till 8 then goes flat and a bit stuttery
Between 6 and 8 It's a bit mental. Like 350 lc on 250 gearing
This is the best it has run so some progress
Steve
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Post by midlifecrisisrd on May 19, 2020 21:03:19 GMT 1
Plug seems to confirm it's way rich up top I'm now convinced they have been modded. Maybe they are running 350 power jets so 55 instead of 25 It seems fine at idle as needs choke to start and runs clean without machine gunning at low revs Steve  |
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Post by russie on May 19, 2020 21:10:00 GMT 1
Can you run it with the PV's wedged fully open, and do you have the original carb settings for a standard bike? Great idea. I had a similar problem with my TZR250 and this is how I found it. When I rode it with Powervalves fixed full open, it would rev right out no problem. Turned out to be a faulty plug cap which I can only assume was causing electrical interference and upsetting the PV computer causing it to start closing the valves when they should have been full open. I lost a lot of time diagnosing that particular problem 🙄 |
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Post by hoist1 on May 19, 2020 21:49:25 GMT 1
Would never be surprised at anything. Have been lucky enough sometimes to instantly solve running problems, couple of car examples both round the back of dealers in the bargain basement section. Strangely both Audi’s, different dealers. An 80 that apparently was a bit knackered, took a bit of a chance on fresh oil that sorted the hydraulic tappets. The other one a 5 cylinder 90, was just luck it was nearly dark, ran badly, when I lifted the bonnet could see loads of arcing from the leads. Both turned out sweet. A bike example was a dealer with a mint cbr400, was cheap because they thought it had a camchain problem, of course they don’t have one.
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Post by midlifecrisisrd on May 19, 2020 22:25:22 GMT 1
I'm going to put the spannies back on it and see how it runs then
Wish me luck
Steve
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Post by hoist1 on May 19, 2020 22:28:53 GMT 1
I'm going to put the spannies back on it and see how it runs then Wish me luck Steve Has it got good lights, hope they better than zx9. |
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Post by midlifecrisisrd on May 19, 2020 22:33:46 GMT 1
I'm going to put the spannies back on it and see how it runs then Wish me luck Steve Has it got good lights, hope they better than zx9. Lol, I'll wait till tomorrow Steve |
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Post by hoist1 on May 19, 2020 22:39:33 GMT 1
Hope it works for you, sounds like a road going tz would be easier. 😊
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Post by hoist1 on May 19, 2020 22:42:22 GMT 1
Hope it works for you, sounds like a road going tz would be easier. 😊 And then there’s your project, will be satisfying when you get there though, which I guess is what drives you. |
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Post by midlifecrisisrd on May 20, 2020 11:52:28 GMT 1
Just fitted the spannies again but not road tested yet
It's funny how pipes affect jetting so much
With the standard pipes you need choke for the first minute
With the spannies on it starts without choke
Didn't think it would affect low jetting so much
Steve
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Post by LC_BOTT on May 20, 2020 12:51:51 GMT 1
Just fitted the spannies again but not road tested yet With the standard pipes you need choke for the first minute With the spannies on it starts without choke Steve It's like Barbados outside at the moment, do you not have any sun there yet?  |
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Post by reedpete on May 20, 2020 13:15:02 GMT 1
Sun ?
Billy Connolly summed it up, takes a whole summer to turn from pale blue to white up there!
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Post by midlifecrisisrd on May 20, 2020 13:21:53 GMT 1
Just fitted the spannies again but not road tested yet With the standard pipes you need choke for the first minute With the spannies on it starts without choke Steve It's like Barbados outside at the moment, do you not have any sun there yet? It's feckin scorching 😁 Too hot and sweaty to wrestle a leather jacket on Back to painting my carport 😕 Steve |
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Post by midlifecrisisrd on May 20, 2020 16:29:14 GMT 1
That's the linked carbs sorted 🤣  |
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Post by Yogi on May 20, 2020 16:43:09 GMT 1
I can believe you’d do that 😱
Save the tee piece and pipe clips 🙈🤣🤣
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Post by midlifecrisisrd on May 20, 2020 16:51:02 GMT 1
I can believe you’d do that 😱 Save the tee piece and pipe clips 🙈🤣🤣 You know me better than that... ...the T and clips are for 10mm ID tube so no good. The floats, valves, jets, air screws, idle screw, needles and slides? Now they are getting stripped 🤣🤣🤣 Steve |
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Post by Yogi on May 20, 2020 16:56:05 GMT 1
Normality has returned 👌 I thought I’d heard of my first frivolous jock 🤣🤣🤣
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Post by midlifecrisisrd on May 20, 2020 17:57:31 GMT 1
Normality has returned 👌 I thought I’d heard of my first frivolous jock 🤣🤣🤣 Damn right, I paid £30 for the rebuild kits 😤 Steve 😁 |
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Post by perazzi350 on May 20, 2020 18:07:12 GMT 1
Normality has returned 👌 I thought I’d heard of my first frivolous jock 🤣🤣🤣 Damn right, I paid £30 for the rebuild kits 😤 Steve 😁 LOL thats exactly where mine are going OKO a'int worth a shit |
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