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Post by dusty350 on Nov 4, 2022 18:40:46 GMT 1
Hi When I stripped the 350Lc engine that came in the Fzrd earlier this year, I found the bores to be on 2.25 over, so very near the end of their life, rebore wise. I wanted to build the engine back up to be as good as it could possibly be for a standard spec 350, and just wasn't happy that the bores were that much over. I spoke to Paul at PJME, and as well as asking him to supply me a new crank, we spoke about resleeving the barrels. Paul has offered a resleeving service for many years now and initially it was MotorCross bikes he was doing, back in the early 90's. I was watching the prices of 350Lc barrels on ebay, and couldn't believe the sums that were being asked for them  Plus they were often in need of work/rebore anyway, so the spending wouldn't have stopped even if I had sourced some used ones. A couple of very average pairs were north of a grand, before rebore/pistons/cosmetic finishing, so it was a no brainer for me to ask Paul to resleeve my 4L0 01 barrels. Now Paul is always super busy, but he very kindly took some pics of the process and provided the details, so we can all see what's involved. I did a thread on the 400e crank rebuild that Paul did for me in the past, and I think it made for interesting reading, so if you ever wondered how it's done, hopefully this will help  Dusty  |
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Post by headcoats on Nov 4, 2022 19:55:06 GMT 1
Do they re sleeve YPVS barrels as they have some serious holes in them 😱
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Post by badger1 on Nov 4, 2022 20:02:59 GMT 1
How much does it cost?
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Post by dusty350 on Nov 4, 2022 20:20:00 GMT 1
Yes, they resleeve Pv barrels. Prices are on the PJME website; PRICES FOR 2 STROKE CYLINDERS 50cc To 125cc From £150.00 + VAT Per Bore 250cc From £165 + VAT Per Bore 500CC From £250 +VAT Per Bore Yamaha DT125R,TZR125,RD125LC, DT125LC ALL £185.00 + VAT Per Bore Yamaha RD250, RD350, RD400, RD350LC, RD350YPVS,RD500, TZR250,TDR250 ALL £215.00 + VAT Per Bore lambretta TS1 RB Etc From £160.00 + VAT Per Bore Turnaround time is at the moment (13/01/2022) 6 to 7 weeks . We only work on the bare cylinder so power valves & cylinder head studs etc must be removed. An addition charge will be made to strip any studs or power valves. All prices are Plus VAT |
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Post by badger1 on Nov 4, 2022 21:04:06 GMT 1
That’s not as much as I thought it would be, I wonder if that’s inc a piston and already to go or I’m I wanting to much for my money.
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Post by dusty350 on Nov 4, 2022 21:45:39 GMT 1
I dropped my barrels off to Paul on the way home from a trip up North, and picked up my new crank he had built at the same time The first job is to draw up a job sheet, and stamp the barrels for easy identification;  thumbnail by dusty miller, on Flickr The sleeves start life as a solid billet cast iron bar, which is made and cast to Pjme specs;  thumbnail (1) by dusty miller, on Flickr There are spun cast sleeves that are available, but these tend to be low quality, with blow holes and porosity in them, hence Paul's use of billet. All machining work is done "in house". The solid bar is offered up to the lathe, and the bar is going to become a sleeve !;  thumbnail by dusty miller, on Flickr |
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Post by dusty350 on Nov 4, 2022 22:13:39 GMT 1
"The 350Lc is one of the most challenging cylinders to fit a new sleeve to. The issue comes about due to the way Yamaha cast the original sleeve into the cylinder" "They accurately cast the sleeve out of cast iron and then fitted this into the mould, and then cast the alloy around it" This is not an uncommon process, but due to packaging the 2 cylinders quite close together, the transfer tunnels are formed by the sleeve itself rather than the alloy part of the cylinder. It is this part that makes it tricky, as we need to leave this part in the cylinder and fit our new sleeve inside it" "Normally, we would not want any of the old sleeve left - we would just bore it all out. But if you did this on an Lc's cylinders, you would end up with a massive, thick sleeve" |
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Post by donkeychomp on Nov 4, 2022 22:26:55 GMT 1
Very interesting indeed. Nice to know someone does them and the prices are pretty good I'd say. Must take a lot of work.
Alex
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Post by dusty350 on Nov 4, 2022 22:31:54 GMT 1
A port map may be taken of the original cylinders before any work is started on them. It maybe that any specialist porting may need to be saved. On a side note, Paul can lower the inlet/exhaust ports to as close as standard as possible, but in the case of the exhaust port roof you will have a step. Likewise, the transfer ports can be lowered if they had been tuned/raised, and they can be blended in as much as possible. Back to the sleeves, and after an awful amount of swarf, 2 bare sleeves are produced;  thumbnail (8) by dusty miller, on Flickr  thumbnail (4) by dusty miller, on Flickr Once the sleeve has been made on the lathe, the OD is ground - the finish of the outside of the sleeve and the inside of the bore is critical to good heat transfer |
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Post by billbott on Nov 4, 2022 23:22:38 GMT 1
Come on Dusty, next instalment quick please, was enjoying the read 😂
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Post by JonW on Nov 4, 2022 23:28:40 GMT 1
Excellent info! Good idea Dusty and Paul.
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Post by andy748 on Nov 4, 2022 23:51:42 GMT 1
Great info Dusty, i might send my Ypvs barrels off to Paul for a make over. Cheers, Andy.
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Post by tonyd123 on Nov 5, 2022 10:04:39 GMT 1
Great to see pics of the process  |
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Post by dusty350 on Nov 5, 2022 10:37:36 GMT 1
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Post by jon on Nov 5, 2022 10:46:29 GMT 1
Yes, they resleeve Pv barrels. Prices are on the PJME website; PRICES FOR 2 STROKE CYLINDERS 50cc To 125cc From £150.00 + VAT Per Bore 250cc From £165 + VAT Per Bore 500CC From £250 +VAT Per Bore Yamaha DT125R,TZR125,RD125LC, DT125LC ALL £185.00 + VAT Per Bore Yamaha RD250, RD350, RD400, RD350LC, RD350YPVS,RD500, TZR250,TDR250 ALL £215.00 + VAT Per Bore lambretta TS1 RB Etc From £160.00 + VAT Per Bore Turnaround time is at the moment (13/01/2022) 6 to 7 weeks . We only work on the bare cylinder so power valves & cylinder head studs etc must be removed. An addition charge will be made to strip any studs or power valves. All prices are Plus VAT How funny. I thought you’d made a typo with the TS1 and others price, but realise it was PJME themselves on their website and you just cut and pasted it. Jon |
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Post by abar121 on Nov 5, 2022 15:49:42 GMT 1
Great job Dusty!
I've got a 31k set to send for resleeving soon, great to see what's involved.
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Post by arrdy350 on Nov 5, 2022 16:06:18 GMT 1
Very interesting to see how it is done 👍
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Post by headcoats on Nov 5, 2022 16:15:37 GMT 1
I guess having to cut the ports out from scratch you could have a tune put in ?
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Post by jon on Nov 5, 2022 16:55:05 GMT 1
I guess having to cut the ports out from scratch you could have a tune put in ? Or a detune. I’ve got a TS1 cylinder that is tuned and lined. It has a wedge shaped exhaust port which I’d really like to have an oval. I wonder if the liner can be removed, the alluminium cylinder welded up and a new liner fitted? I think I’ll ask PJME. Jon |
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Post by dusty350 on Nov 5, 2022 20:19:30 GMT 1
Paul doesn't do tuning, but a sleeve with standard porting may then get ported by a specialist to replicate a previous tune, hence copying the port map before any work is commenced. You can speak to him directly regards what you need done - he has over 30 years experience, and he reckons on 20,000 resleeves in that time Dusty |
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Post by dusty350 on Nov 5, 2022 20:30:18 GMT 1
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Post by sidney81 on Nov 5, 2022 21:32:17 GMT 1
Very interesting stuff dusty ,nice to see it all 🧐
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Post by alankelly on Nov 5, 2022 22:31:42 GMT 1
Hi Dusty Paul resleeved my barrels on the yellow peril as they were 2mm O/S with heavy scores Also supplied a new crank, pistons to suit the resleeved barrels and a skimmed and reprofiled head👍👍 Great guy and a great service and highly recommended him    |
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Post by dusty350 on Nov 5, 2022 22:44:20 GMT 1
Hi Al I think he has done a few for members on here. One guy had barrels that had been previously bored out badly and were off centre, and basically scrap. Paul managed to centre new sleeves and save the cylinders |
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Post by steeley on Nov 6, 2022 16:41:02 GMT 1
Nice . I am waiting to hear about the magic nikasil plating to make worn out cylinders like new again . I had my 350LC cylinders re sleeved some years ago by Armstrong engineering and am happy with the job .
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Post by keith101 on Nov 7, 2022 10:16:36 GMT 1
Yes I found him really helpful, I sent some off to be done and he advised to just bore out as the tune wasn't excessive and you'd still have steps in the exhaust etc. Now having seen the work that goes into each one the cost is far from excessive and they can't be making much profit.
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Post by steveb64 on Nov 30, 2022 6:10:17 GMT 1
Great info Dusty going to drop my damaged barrels off this week
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Post by dusty350 on Nov 30, 2022 8:11:20 GMT 1
Great stuff Steve - you will be really impressed with Paul and his work I need to update the thread - not finished it yet !! Dusty |
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Post by yamman1066 on Nov 30, 2022 10:22:08 GMT 1
whats the cost to have them done please ?
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Post by headcoats on Nov 30, 2022 10:41:31 GMT 1
This is brilliant but you know we always want more !
How about a feature when he does a set of YPVS barrels 🤗
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Plus they were often in need of work/rebore anyway, so the spending wouldn't have stopped even if I had sourced some used ones. A couple of very average pairs were north of a grand, before rebore/pistons/cosmetic finishing, so it was a no brainer for me to ask Paul to resleeve my 4L0 01 barrels.
