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Post by JonW on Jan 14, 2021 23:01:26 GMT 1
I’ve had 3 Evo’s over the years, a 6 an 8 and a 10 all great cars , deffo the 6 that I have fondest memories of though, I hear you. While this is my first Evo, Ive had a bunch of Subarus and the one I have the best memories of is the GC8 (2000 model). That era of car just 'works' for me I think.
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Post by 29davyt on Jan 15, 2021 11:57:24 GMT 1
I put a deposit down on a new year 2000 car after a mate picked one up from Holland for £14500 ( massive savings back then on uk prices) but was told there were no cars available and would have to wait for the new model , god damn wasn’t it an ugly duckling when the first pictures were released in the press?? Went through with the purchase anyway even the price had shot up to over £17K, must of been one of the first in the country, it didn’t even have the rear spoiler as standard which made it look even worse 🥴, kept it about 10 months then traded it for the Evo 6 ..
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Post by JonW on Jan 15, 2021 13:06:53 GMT 1
Haha, I bought a 'Classic Scooby' (what we call here a 'GC8') in 1999 which was delivered in 2000. Ordered and delivered to GJ Kempen BV in South Holland in right hand drive 'uk spec'. The dealer was superb and very helpful, not just in ordering the car. I flew over, had a weekend in A'dam, trained down to the dealer. Had night out with Fritz Kempen (lovely bloke who owned the dealership), stayed at his house (so kind of him) and then got up early and drove to Calais and Hovercrafted home, just before that service ended. Was a great car, I still miss it. Waiting for the Hovercraft that first (long) drive home: 3 years later... the odd mod here n there. Full sti spec, massive brakes, P1 wheels and a very long list of suspension and other mods lol. So fast and handled so well. Fastest way to cross country in the UK at the time for sure for the money. Ahh so you got one of the 'bug eyes'... yeah... what were they thinking The Evo would have been a huge step up from that shape WRX for sure. Brembos, OZ 17s, Recaros, waterspray, etc etc and 300bhp, not 217ish.
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Post by 29davyt on Jan 15, 2021 13:46:26 GMT 1
Sweet looking motor Jon ! Yeah the Evo was in a different league to the Bug eye that’s for sure, not just in raw power but in every department, reckon they were way before their time tbh,, I’ll get some pics up later of some of them. My mate and I went over to Rotterdam for my WRX, took the overnight ferry from Hull, always remember hitting the piano bar at about 4 pm and supping till the early hours 😂
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Post by 29davyt on Jan 15, 2021 14:28:24 GMT 1
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Post by JonW on Jan 16, 2021 2:09:31 GMT 1
Ohhhh now that is a great back catalogue!
Love the Quattro UR, Ive always wanted one but now i have the fear of disappointment with the idea :/
Do you still have the RS? I wanted one and followed the development and the teaser vids Ford put out etc but glad I didnt get one (bought the WRX instead in much the same colour) as ever since all I hear are bad things about them and while they were everywhere when new you almost never see one now. Have they really all disappeared in so few years? Same with mustangs over here, when new i saw one every journey, now I never see them.
Anyway, love your choices (apart from that bugeye haha!)
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Post by 29davyt on Jan 16, 2021 10:33:29 GMT 1
Yeah the Quattro was well under powered, it’s funny I always thought it was a big car but I saw one the other month parked up, it looked quiet small against modern cars ! No the RS went after a year of ownership, it was a nice car tbh, went well but got rid after I got head gasket done, upgraded to one below, my second GTR( which is now gone due to house move😢) , still see a few RS’s on the roads and plenty of mustangs over here.. 42A7D751-527E-4F14-BDC9-9D4401031868 by
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Post by JonW on Jan 17, 2021 1:57:07 GMT 1
Ohhh love that GTR! Out of my league here sadly with our pricing, what a car tho.
To keep this on track for the 90s stuff... Prices of JDM cars are still going through the roof...
As usual thats never good. Bad if you want to buy one, same if you own one as theft is rife here as most have no protection being JDM where little theft occurs. I was told never to leave my Evo parked in Sydney for any length of time when i bought it and I never do. Insurance wont even insure cars that are not garaged over night now here. Traditionally we are not bad for theft of cars either.
Re the prices, I watched an interesting live stream from a Brit who buys cars in Japan for overseas customers the other day. He was moaning that people dont know how hard it is to get something good now at auction and that most buyers abroad are totally unrealistic in what they expect price and condition wise.
He was saying that even junk with rust and tape holding the steel together with dents in the wings and needing re-painting was silly money as demand far outstrips supply.
Apparently the Japanese are now realising what they have locally and keeping things in japan rather than sell them to us. They did that will bikes and killed a lot of the foreign bike importers ages back etc.
With the Japanese now also looking for these cars locally and America's 25 year import rules kicking in for this era, the market shows no signs of slowing down anytime soon.
I took his point that while we've been calling the price increases 'covid tax' the past year, while that is sort of true as people have been sat at home and buying things they have been meaning to buy for a while, really it's that none of these cars are plentiful now and that there are more players in the market as well, this means demand is up while supply was always getting worse... and we all know what that means for prices.
To keep that generic market info about these cars he did say that sti RAs were now getting silly money as they come through auction (bummer for me as I have been tempted by a RA 2 door for a while now) and that the day he made the video an Evo 5 went through the auction for £13k that was a grade 2 and you could put your hand through the floors it was so rusty. He said the rule was to add 3k to ship it to your country, 1k for his efforts and then add imports/vat and fees to the lot when it lands. Then fix the issues of an obviously unloved car. If that's the state of the bottom of the market the top is never going to be cheap.
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Post by veg on Jan 17, 2021 18:53:28 GMT 1
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Post by JonW on Jan 18, 2021 1:03:02 GMT 1
Tim, Im not 100% im the right guy to ask as Im not up on the UK market and the cars from 2001-2014 are not ones ive owned, tho ive seen lots of them in the workshop and heard stories of joy and woe from my mate. He has owned/worked on/wrecked/crashed/stripped/rebuilt plenty of them tho and I'm surrounded by them in his workshop. FWIW I did nearly buy a 2005 Sti when he had one for sale, I should have bought it really as it was a good price ahh well. So anyway, my advice might be a bit generic, but hopefully useful... After driving modern cars I would defo go and test drive something old if you are thinking of using it everyday and see what you think. While an old car is great for handling (less weight, less wheel size vs more tyre etc etc) Ive found that I get used to the modern tech in my daily and would struggle 'going backwards' for keeps. Sat Nav, decent AC (tho everyone says the Evo has the coldest AC of any car lol), reverse cameras/360 view, leather seats, cross traffic alerts, blind spot alerts, a billion airbags etc and of course very good crash protection. All are things you get very used to having. Couple that with old cars always needing something and the dream can get old quickly. That said, I would daily my Evo in a heartbeat, but I do minimal miles as I dont drive for work as we take the train into the city etc. so its mostly local miles. If i did big miles for work the Evo maintenance would kill me, thats why i didnt buy one when they were new lol. One thing I would say about most cars of this era is that they are not big cars, in fact cars have been putting on weight and size dramatically over the years. Last week we parked a 2008 S class merc in Limo spec (extra foot of body) between an 130 and something like a mazda 3 and the S class looked small. I always think the Classic scooby and the GD models are tiny to sit in and you sit close to the screen. In fact even the B4 I was driving last week felt really tiny to me and thats compared to the Evo I was also driving, which must have seemed massive back in the late 90s. My 2016 WRX is just massive to sit in after those lol. Yeah, head gaskets are a subaru thing it seems sadly, especially the more modern ones. I do worry about that with my 2016 WRX, but its only done 30k kms in 5 years so its a way off for me i hope lol. The '03 (i think) B4 I mentioned earlier has over 200k miles on it and has never had gaskets... go figure. That car has a light tune and been caned mercilessly for years as its my mates car and is driven by all sorts and seems to always love it. Generally Subarus were built tough and so long as you keep them standard engine wise they will last well. Internet tunes and random ebay go-faster parts are to be avoided, but even well known tuners can stuff them up of course. The interiors last well but paintwork was always thin. Remember these were just cheap old Imprezzas that got the good parts so the bodywork and most of the interiors are hardwearing but cheap feeling compared to a modern car. Seats will be great tho. As you know, with older cars you will have no idea how they were treated as youve no idea who the PO was, yeah just like our bikes. These are performance cars, at some point they will have been abused by someone. Thats fine, its what they are for and they love it, but they need to be looked after too. The 'Classic' (GC8/GF8) is the one everyone is looking at as a classic car now but the eye cars (bug, blob and hawk eyes) will be next I would think. Like the LC2 vs the LC. In fact thats very apt comparison. Not the madness of the original and only slightly diluted in the name of progress - ie better to live with, but less raw. I would think buying a good high spec (STI) 2000s car now would see you not lose (even make) in the long run so long as the market doesnt crash (unlikely, with the USA imports coming on stream etc) but hey financial advice from a forum... well... lol). Anything post 2010 is still going down in value i would think? I dont know the UK market but even here thats still the case and our cars always hold their value as they cost more to start with. I love the hatchback of the 2010+ STI models but could not find a nice one here when i got our 2016 new. I know a guy who track days one and loves it though. I hear you on spoilers, but... if youre looking for future value and you want the playstation generation to be your next buyer then you probably need a be-winged one as thats what they 'drove' in the games. There will always be those who want to fly under the radar, but the market will perhaps be smaller as they are niche? Perhaps the spoiler-less models will appreciate quicker as the 'gentleman's sports saloon' but I guess Im a bit crass and like the crazy spoiler era, to me they added 'theatre' to the normal saloon body and were very 'rally'. As usual with old stuff I would buy the best you can afford. Check import milages using the online Japanese databases (small fee applies) before you commit and make sure you have everything you are promised (tool kit, auction report, expert certificate (in Aus you need this), service books etc). Be wary of the 'new tyres and brake pads' lines in ads, often they needed to be fitted as the car has been unused for years and dealers dont usually spend up on the decent stuff as they dont know what they will sell the car for and these cars need good tyres and pads of course. That said my Evo was sat for years in Japan and while it needed a few things (tank clean, fuel sender, fuel filters, injector clean, belts, all the oils changing and i replaced some hoses that looked a bit powdery as the rubber got old) its come good easily enough and loves to be used. But yeah, the dealer who imported and sold me the car fitted the cheapest noname brand tyres and pads in it, the car drove like it was on ice lol. Easily sorted, but more expense and a wasted set of cheap tyres etc. Ok, my thoughts on the cars you mentioned, make of this what you will, I am not an expert on them. 2013 model. its got nice low miles and will go/handle well enough and have history etc. Defo closer to your previous modern cars inside but will feel a let down I suspect after the GTI and 997. Eg The radio is modern enough for you to think it will work ok (unlike an old tape deck only 90s car) but will be crap lol. You might be able to retro fit a newer double din unit with nav in it tho as its modern enough for that. Looks like a normal imprezza so will fly under the radar for cops n thieves perhaps? Has its merits but wont appreciate quickly in value, probably still heading down at this point. But is newer and if using every day you'd worry less about it, ie in winter. The V7 STI. I'd actually quite like this one as a classic car. Its a great spec and being a 4B grade at auction is in good nick, you almost never see a 5 or an A, 4.5 is the best you can hope for with a JDM car. I feel it's not too perfect or so few miles that you'd not want to use it and there are still some things you could improve as well like the boot carpet and a few small jobs. The fact its not been smoked in is amazing, most JDM cars are owned by smokers as Japanese males of the age group who would have owned cars like these are usually chain smokers. My Evo is a smoke free car. Very hard to find this and my ex-smoker's nose would struggle with one that had ever had a fag in the ash tray. If you smoke its no big deal, but if you dont... I thought the ring lands were an issue on the 02/03 cars but by 66k miles any issues would be found id have thought. The V7 engine's were all forged and semi closed deck (both good things). Its a strong unit as detailed here: forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2385141These cars were much more modern than the old GC8 and the V7 feels more grown up to drive as said earlier plus they have brembos and 17s as standard. it says that one has a 6 speed... I thought 6 speed came in 05 so maybe its been retrofitted? Im no expert tho. FWIW The 6 speed is a conversion done a lot on GC8s and isnt cheap to do so thats a nice thing to have. Strong 'box if you ever want more power etc. The ad also lists stuff that is standard on a V7, like Momo wheel and R180 diff (great solid unit for power but ratio not mentioned so assume std v7 version) etc so is a bit weird. And UEL headers went on much later than 2002 so dunno what that is about. The bola wheels look great but are just modern cheapies from Demon Tweaks not something rare and JDM from the era. A mint set of standard wheels with good OEM paint (hard to find and hard to find as few seem to re-do the exact OEM colour) would be best, but IMHO I'd use the bolas as well as they look good on the car. Negotiate both sets in the deal etc. To sum up my feeling is that these are quite different cars. The 2013 is low miles and in my mind would be the better 'daily' as its going to be a long time before its a classic, its more modern and parts are/will be more readily available. It will depreciate but be easy to use and abuse with impunity and low miles means the HGs are some way off if they are to go. The V7 is pretty much a classic car and as such while it could be used daily you might feel more protective of it the way prices are going up these days. It will need some underseal at the very least if you want to use a JDM car in the UK winter or it'll rust away, JDM cars do not have underseal as a rule. In the true ethos of 'Escape to the Subaru' (my spin off idea based on Location, Location, Location and Escape to the Country TV shows) I'd offer this Mystery Car. As usual its out of your budget (negotiate hard!) and its not what you wanted lol. It is a Subaru tho... and it is an Impreza. Use and abuse this as a daily, it'll do most of what anyone could ever want from an AWD performance car thats not a Golf R lol, but its not going to go up in value I fear. www.pistonheads.com/buy/listing/11051465?cId=9629476&cId=9652180&cId=11067465&cId=11067466&cId=10289878&cId=10312598&cId=11111106&cId=11062309&cId=11051465&cId=10602670&cId=11045606&cId=11169605Ok, all that said, you could daily any of these, depending on milage of course and just drive em into the ground. Which do you prefer? and what 'use' are you thinking?
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Post by JonW on Jan 18, 2021 1:34:01 GMT 1
As an aside to Tim's question, I flicked through the cars listed on the main website thats selling the V7 and was interested to see the cars and the prices. Quite different to here... so many Evo 4 its unreal as we dont have that many here as for some reason you couldnt register them until last year. Prices of them are much keener than the 5 & 6. While the spec of the 4 is less over the 5/6 and the looks are more staid I do wonder if those are cheaper as Aus and USA were not markets for them as imports for years so prices in Japan are keener. Im not sure what values make up say a sale price of a 'just landed' Evo 4 in the UK at £9995 that they list. Out of that £10k how much is made up of fees: eg, local buyers fee, transport in Japan to dock, export release fee in Japan, shipping, insurance, import into uk (vat and customs and port fees), transport from port to office, MOT and making ready for road (tyres, brakes, service etc), small jobs to make nice (broken things, obvious dents removed, chips that detract painted), registration+plates, vat on sale, profit. What does that mean the sale price in Japan is I wonder? Ok, you can see the prices of the ones going through auction on some websites even see auction lists in some places (some cost to join tho), but maybe the margins are quite small on some uk sales, using the 'make little but sell often' model? I know some dealers here buy odd things they see and just try the prices on here in case they sell. I saw one guy selling an old Jimny Turbo he told me he paid $1k at auction, he wanted $15k here. Even with shipping, registration, compliance, tyres/brakes etc being the same as a 100k car, the taxes/imports/insurance were low. No idea what it eventually sold for but $15k wasnt awful for what it was in this market. Obviously not going to sell fast, but it was cheap enough to take a punt on I guess unlike something like an R34GTR lol. For those interested this is an Aussie site i use now and then for the prices of importing these cars to Aus. The prices to the UK or USA would be different obviously but it does have good into about the grading of cars and also the spread of those going through the auctions and their prices/miles/colours/quality grading etc. It doesnt have all the cars listed as some we just can import here (if a similar model was sold here for example) so no point them teasing us with them. www.j-spec.com.au/typical_sale_prices
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cnkxu1
Thrash Merchant
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Post by cnkxu1 on Jan 18, 2021 7:47:44 GMT 1
I put this up for sale a few weeks ago and was inundated by what seemed like scam calls from people wanting to buy without inspection asking for bank details. I withdrew it and will probably sell it through an auction house. MY00 Club Spec EVO IV
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Post by JonW on Jan 18, 2021 8:37:09 GMT 1
I put this up for sale a few weeks ago and was inundated by what seemed like scam calls from people wanting to buy without inspection asking for bank details. I withdrew it and will probably sell it through an auction house. MY00 Club Spec EVO IV yep totally crazy folk out there looking for GC8s now. Looks nice. Out of interest what did you put it up for? Message me if you prefer to not put that info online.
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Post by veg on Jan 18, 2021 17:31:12 GMT 1
Thanks so much for the advice jon If I’m honest the older blob eye really does appeal, I want something that is a little different I appreciate that they aren’t modern day by the latest standards and they are probably more visceral than say my golf gti which is a fabulous car but very sterile and dare I say it pretty boring. It’s never going to be a day to day car and the mileage I do at the moment doesn’t justify it being so. I can always use the family car for day to day and likely as not my wife is unlikely to ever go back to the international and national travel she did previously and not for that matter am I. I’ve always been a fan of wrc and for me one of the greatest ever drivers is and always will be colin McRae so to potter about in a Scooby has its appeal. I’ll keep in touch. Cheers Tim
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Post by JonW on Jan 18, 2021 22:28:00 GMT 1
Sounds good Tim. If you have access to another more modern car as well then absolutely something like the V7 would make sense. Just add some rust protection if you want to use it in the winter and go out and enjoy it I would think. These are very capable cars and still out perform much of the modern traffic unlike the usual old classic cars are to drive. ie stopping, accelerating and handling still keep you ahead of the idiots in their modern cars. Interesting you say the Golf was sterile and 'boring'. I would agree with that. My modern WRX is great as a super comfy modern car, but the Evo is much more fun to actually 'drive' when on it. Its not like a TVR with no drivers aids but it takes what you put in and uses it, actual connected throttle and hydraulic steering etc with no computer to cut in and 'help'. Much more visceral. Of course no screens and a tape deck means no distractions too so you stay focused.
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Post by veg on Jan 18, 2021 22:41:26 GMT 1
That’s what I want the purest driving experience I’ve had wasn’t the 911 or anything new it was my old rover Mini Cooper s 1.3 with sport pack it’d do 110 down a hill 70 up it but it was alive, I’ve driven my brothers scooby impreza mk1 sw and enjoyed it, the other choices were Renault 5 turbo I know or something completely opposite a Holden vxr, I’m mates with the owner of tvr power but that’s a step to far and even he drives porker turbo. Cheers
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Post by JonW on Jan 19, 2021 1:40:17 GMT 1
Yes sounds to me like you need an oldie to recapture that driving feeling. Tho you might also remember why we drive modern cars when not 'on it', but 'rough with the smooth' etc. My WRX has a few issues (warranty will cover it but...) at the mo and I am tempted to ditch it and buy something else. It is tempting just to drive the Evo tho... I drove a tuned 1275 mini a year or two back. Like many my age in the UK I had access to loads back in the day and ranted 'em everywhere. loved them to bits... but, when i had this one it scared the crap out of me on modern city roads. slow and small and no crash protection for snowflake 50yr old me lol. Great fun in the twisties, but no fun on 3 lane roads with massive trucks and Sydney's terrible drivers I do wish I lived out of town as Id love one. Everyone should drive a mini hard at least once in their lives. Telepathic steering, lots of gear changes and making use of your speed etc. The R5 turbo would be fun. I assume you mean the road car, not the mad rally thing. Being 80s it'll probably be a bit flawed I always think. Wasnt the small one was only a 1.4? I know it had a very on/off 80s 'too big' turbo ...nothing... nothing... nothing... bang! change gear, repeat from 'nothing'. Cheap build quality being french and I dont know how hard bits would be to get for one now. I drove one in the early 90s when my mate wanted to buy one. defo went like a cut snake, brakes seemed optional and it was a small car to pivot around corners. The Clio Williams he also looked at was much better to drive really, but less frantic. The Lancia delta HF Turbo we tried to test drive caught fire. Mad day out. Ahh the VXR... what does petrol cost in the uk at mo? lol. cnkxu1 will have advice for you on Holdens in sure, as will LB he has several in his fleet. While I'd love a Maloo Ute I generally stay away from holdens as the build quality wasnt the best. The VF was the best of the bunch but will have a bunch of drivers 'aids' I suspect, those were the ones just before they canned it cos we Aussie's didnt want to buy a performance saloon car... and then Kia started selling Stingers and cant bring em in quick enough. Go figure. Mazda is bringing out a performance 6 Ive been told to compete with the Stinger. hmm... Anyway this week an admittedly rare modern holden sold for over $1m (570k of your pounds). Just mental if you ask me, but what do i know lol www.news.com.au/technology/motoring/motoring-news/rare-hsv-gtsr-w1-maloo-sets-aussie-car-auction-record/news-story/e2c57d5d8341e13a45eef6d8a62c48dcHaha, lightweight! I drove my Tamora through the winter as my only car in 03 including slipping and sliding across the Cat n Fiddle in a blizzard on the day i picked it up. Much puckering. It really was a great car tho. Talk about visceral, it had that in spades. The traction control consisted of long throttle pedal travel to stop you unleashing all the power too soon. Plenty of stories of owning that car. I loved it. I keep hoping to find a T350 here thats not silly money (only personal imports here) so I can get another. One day.... I hope... One car that wont be that fast but would be good to drive (and own?) is a Mk2 golf. I bet they are silly money in the UK now. I turbo'd mine (a 16v) with a Turbo Technics kit. It was a mad thing. dialed back to about 215bhp it was just about usable as you couldnt put the power down even on OZ 17s. people put VW/Audi 2L motors in em or 1.8T etc that were more reliable and easier to tune than the old 16v setup i had. would be fun to have now really and should never have sold mine when i moved here. Sleeper looks, silly power = smile on face. (absolutely not an AWD 90s rally car lol)
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cnkxu1
Thrash Merchant
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Post by cnkxu1 on Jan 19, 2021 5:56:56 GMT 1
Have to agree with the comment about really knowing you are driving when I remember back to an ex-police 1100 Mini with twin SUs. Speedo went to 90mph and then kept going past the fuel gauge and round to the zero. With four people in the car. Another one I wish I had kept.
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Post by veg on Jan 19, 2021 8:08:42 GMT 1
Funny how all the old stuff is going the ways of lc’s price wise early to mid 90’s I ended working in sales even worked for the same dealers as john ‘Guirri’ I worked for Bmw then merc, I used to shun the newer stuff most of the time that was my intro to rear wheel drive 325 sport (lethal in the wet) e30 m3-e34 m5, loads of interesting performances motors taken in px I was like a kid in a sweat shop. We even had an Alfa Sz never drove that though. Happy days no speed cameras, gsxr1100 in the garage and my pic of some fabulous cars. The I took a 50% pay cut and joined dibble 🤔 I do love early golfs problem lots were ‘max powered’ in the day so finding a nice one is hard. Then you look at cossies bloody £100k for a nice one never really a Ford fan though.
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Post by 29davyt on Jan 19, 2021 11:21:15 GMT 1
More early to mid 90’s but don’t forget the Sunny/Pulsar GTi Turbo ! Proper little flying machine, my Mrs had the none Turbo version and that was pretty quick back in ‘93, 27 years ago !! A few of my mates had the Renault5 turbos, Big Bang turbo 1.4 engine, they did fly, shame they rusted away in areas like the A pillar after 3-4 years old, the original Gordini rear engine cars are absolute stupid money now, probably all homed in some rich mans coveted collection never to be seen again..
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Post by JonW on Jan 19, 2021 22:38:55 GMT 1
Everything seems to have just doubled in price in the last year here it seems. Its hard to find anything 80s or 90s now without having a sizable budget and we all know that means there will be mutton dressed up as lamb to tempt us as well sadly so its while its always 'buyer beware', that counts more so now. Ive also never been a Ford or a GM fan, but I never liked football either. Means I have to work twice as hard to make pub chat lol Tho my Mrs did have a Puma when we lived in the UK, I loved driving that to the shops and back as where we lived it was all roundabouts and the puma was fun at those speeds. I saw a 205 Gti here the other week. Wow it looked small against the backdrop of the modern local cars. Have to say Ive also never been much of a french car fan. I truly loved the quality of the German 80s cars and stuck with VW and BMW even into the 90s, then as they embarked on becoming cheaply made and unreliable (even when new) I moved into Japanese and found a whole new world of weird, wonderful and very fast cars. Anyway, keep us in the loop with your search Tim, Im sure there is something tasty out there for you to play with.
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Post by donkeychomp on Jan 19, 2021 22:42:08 GMT 1
Minis. Now your talking. My last one had 108bhp through the wheels and was bonkers fast. Thing is it had brakes and the handling to match. Sold it a few years ago for about £4k. Nowadays a real shed of a Mini is that kind of money. Arses.
Alex
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Post by veg on Jan 19, 2021 23:11:24 GMT 1
Alex what you doing? Now a Cooper with a vtec Honda engine 🤔 Will do jon 👍
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Post by JonW on Jan 19, 2021 23:13:28 GMT 1
LOL, no mini chat in here, unless its AWD! (yes i do realise i spoke of minis earlier )
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Post by donkeychomp on Jan 19, 2021 23:57:14 GMT 1
Okay Jon.
So not talking about my car that I sold it had a 1380 lump with twin SUs. 0-60 maybe 4 seconds, maybe a little less. Basically a very tuned engine designed for fast road use. Top end wasn't much because of the gearing but on a twisty B road nothing would keep up with it.
Alex
ps sorry lol
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Post by JonW on Jan 20, 2021 0:46:44 GMT 1
I was reading what Alex said and though, 'we have Mokes here! I should have a look...' I wish I hadnt bothered. They used to be dirt cheap, not any more, typical of the current car climate: www.carsales.com.au/cars/leyland/moke/(basically halve the dollar price for pounds) Notice they are all low milage... Ive driven one and I didnt drive it far either. Was fun tho. lol. Oh and Im allowing Moke chat as its kinda AWD, they made a twini for the army as an alternative to the jeep. It didnt fool anyone lol. As an aside, I did see a mini pickup twini at Castle Coombe in the 90s, twas a beast! of course you cant find mini pickups here anymore, they all rotted away.
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Post by JonW on Jan 20, 2021 0:59:35 GMT 1
Ok... Back to Japanese AWD Performance cars... and the madness that is current Subaru GC8 pricing. Background: In Aus we only ever got 399 2 door WRXs. They were all Version 5 Sti. Why 399? Well it was a limited edition of 400 and one apparently fell off the boat when being unloaded. It's said that it's still resting (rusting?!) gently in the harbour. So fast forward to today, any old, bashed, rashed and leggy V5 is worth $60k plus and nice ones are sailing way north of $100k: www.carsales.com.au/cars/subaru/impreza/wrx-sti-version-5-badge/Worth getting the snorkel out and vying with the sharks to find the lost one perhaps? After the V5 limited edition cars sold so well Subaru brought in 400 V6 the next year. These were 4 door cars only so as not to upset the V5 guys who paid up for the '400 only ever limited edition Sti' cars. I looked very seriously at these when I got my Evo as I really wanted to buy a Subaru GC8 again. But, wow they were all so horrible. Most were very high milage cos as usual for Aussie owned cars they had been driven hard and far. All the interiors were full of red dust and most had mods, some had crazy weird owners as well - one guy drove off in a huff at speed across his own driveway when I said I would not be making an offer nearly totalling the car in the process (lol about it now but it was scary at the time). Another one had water in the boot sills, when i pointed it out the owner said i had put it there! WTAF?! Another was two colours of white front and back, but had apparently never been hit. Worst of all was the one that was rebirthed from two cars, the guy could never get the rear windows to work and that sat on sale for months and months. I did make an offer on the one that was two whites, he wanted 17k and I offered him 12 as it needed the paint sorting and advised him to think about it. He called me back a week later to accept the deal, but I'd moved on. $12k... hmm.... One of my problems was that I was after a standard car or one that could be put back to standard, but of course young lads always know better than the manufacturer and plenty were bodgily cut up for front mounts and random wheels and of course ebay coil overs. lol It was while looking at one car (with dent in the door and water in the lights, seat bolster wear and suspension as loose as a wizard sleeve) that I asked the owner what he was replacing it with and after probing questions to prove I wasnt a car thief he opened his garage door on a recently imported low miles and immaculate Evo which he said only cost him a few $k more than the car he was selling. Here was the condition and spec I was after and I gave up running about looking at overpriced tatty V6s. So... back in 2018 I thought the crop of 200km+ well used V6s were waaay too much money at mid $20k, look at the same cars almost 3 years later. www.carsales.com.au/cars/subaru/impreza/wrx-sti-version-6-badge/This makes Evos with half the mileage and a lot less parking in the sun over the years relative bargains in Aus. They are often not crazily modded in Japan if you want a standard car but of course once they arrive here they usually get lots of 'upgrades' as so much is possible with them. Ok, they are imports not sold here originally like the V5 and V6 Stis (we only had very few 6.5TMs and they are silly money now), but compared to the Scooby they come with the things you (well 'I') wish the V5 and 6 Sti's had; 17's, Brembos, Recaros, FMIC, adjustable spoiler (lol, maybe) etc. That is what sold me on them. www.carsales.com.au/cars/?&q=(And.Service.CARSALES._.(C.Make.Mitsubishi._.(C.Model.Lancer._.(Or.Badge.Evolution%20V._.Badge.Evolution%20VI.))))So, my question: are the GC8s totally overpriced or are the Evos underpriced? hmm... Oh and why is it that after looking at plenty of $100k plus cars I find myself thinking a $38k evo is 'good value' and 'tempting to get another' lol.
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Post by veg on Jan 20, 2021 5:39:03 GMT 1
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Post by JonW on Jan 20, 2021 8:04:53 GMT 1
Haha well yes, 'dedicated' is one word for it LOL Used cars have always been cheaper in the UK to here, tho conversely some new ones (Asian brands usually) are great value. Weird but true. Ahh the 22b... The 22b is the holy grail of Scoobys, wide 2 door body 2.2L engine etc etc. Is it that special? well they didnt make many and they were costly when new. They are huge money now for a GC8.... but not huge money when compared to an R34GTR etc. But yes it is special. Most people will never be able to own a 22b so any other 2 door is the next best bet really. If i was in the UK and wanted a 2 door (which i would of course) I would find a P1. Buy a nice one on 17s (not the optional 18s that ruined the handling, same as when that size is fitted to any GC8/GF8) and enjoy it. Sadly theyre expensive now, but V5 and V6 STIs are also available like the one you showed. 15k miles. stunning! Id love that! Talking of the 22b Reminded me of this video (terrible sound but worth a watch): Must have been on a day when the Evo triangle was free of cops. Love the roads there, less keen on the police presence these days. You will find me there when I get back to the UK at some point. Lots of other great roads nearby as well. What I have always found pretty curious is how the Evo 6.5 TME has been pumped up in the media/forums/fb etc into some sort of 'uber Evo' with most people talking about it like it is akin to a 22b. For many reasons it really is no 22b though, in short its just not that rare or different from the 'normal' (term used advisedly) Evos. That said; performance and handling wise its every bit as fun rewarding to to drive as the Subaru, it just just does things in a different way as the video says. Not bad for a less rare car that's cheaper to buy and maintain. Longer explanation: My reason for sayin this is that in the CP bodyshell you get Evos from 4 to 6.5 (4,5,6,6.5) and they were iteratively improved over the years mostly for rally homologation. The effect of the charges were minimal really year on year, even if sometimes they did more work than you might think. These cars have basically the same engine (4g63), gearbox (5speed), drivetrain with same AYC, same body shell, mostly the same suspension, same interior with different colourways etc etc. Sure, each version of evo has some differences; bumper/spoiler, turbo, suspension tweaks, a few bhp here and there etc. But, you would have to be quite a driver to detect most of these changes on normal roads really. They all drive much the same and stick to the road like glue. So, dont get me wrong, while there is nothing wrong with a TME and it is a great car to drive as the video says, it is not as different (or upgraded) to the normal Evo as a 22b is to the normal STI is my point. They also made thousands of them, like they did every year with the Evo - around 6000 annually, but figures are not always quoted the same so who really knows I wonder. The 2000 6.5 TME is simply the last edition of the CP shell and bears the name of the most famous Rally winner for Mitsubishi to celebrate his championship win... in a car based on the homologated 1998 Evo 5. Ooops, yes... It had been a few years since that win lol. Anyway, as you can see in the video the Evo (any evo really) can hold its own with the 22b but it's just not as rare. Bottom line: If you buy a 2 door STI thinking youve got a 22b you'd be some way from the dream, if you have an Evo 5 or 6 you've really got 99% the same car as the 6.5 TME. Just my 2c. TME owners will just say thats cos I have an Evo 5... no thats a joke, most actual Evo owners will tell you the same. Anyway, 22b aside, the V5/6 Sti is still a great car. The RA and other similar models are interesting as they often offer something more motorsport oriented, some have no AC and I think some have no DCCD (user adjustable center diff) etc, some have roof vents i think too. Im no expert on them sadly so cant comment too much. This is sort of the same with Evos where most of the ones you see on the roads are the GSR models which were supplied for road use. Mitsubishi offered RS models of most CP evos and they came without many things that make the evo the car we know, eg. recaros, 17" OZ alloys, PIAA fog lights, Climate control, electric windows, Brembos and AYC. The idea was that if you got an RS it was because you were going rallying and would fit your own seat, wheels, brakes etc and would only ditch the electrics and AC anyway. I assume this made these models cheaper, but I dont know that for sure. What is amusing is seeing an evo on normal Lancer steel wheels with lancer brakes and seats. very strange.
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