Cheers Alex Just had a look. I wonder if the fact yours is a "Q" plate might make a difference ? I know they can be really funny about them. When I spoke to DVLA a helpful guy said I need 2 forms, one of which is to SORN the bike as you cant do it online without a V5c. Will do the paperwork and see how it goes. Cheers for the info mate.
Made a decision on this today. I have been looking for a 400e to donate it's engine to this project as I thought it would look great with the Tz tank, but finding one at all, and then a half decent one for a decent price seems nigh on impossible. Fitting a 400 in this frame would mean wasting the rad mounts that have been added, so after a few weeks of indecision I decided this frame must have a liquid cooled motor. I had trial fitted an Lc bottom end and 2 things became apparent. Firstly, the castings for the front mounting bolts differ betWeen AC and Lc, so 2 spacers will need to be made for the front engine mounts;
I can mock those up temporarily from copper pipe once I know where the engine needs to sit. The second issue is the rear top engine mount for the AC is very different to an Lc, and as much as I would have loved to have utilised it, I couldn't as it was just in the way and wouldn't let me lift the back of the engine off the frame rails;
Took a bit of time as it was awkward to get at, plus the AC frames are made of pretty heavy gauge steel - thing still weighs a ton even with loads cut off it ! So now I can plan where the engine needs to sit and then draw up some templates for new brackets that will get welded to the frame. My next issue is to decide where the engine needs to sit within the rails. I did think of fitting an Lc swingarm and wheel, plus an output shaft with a sprocket into the cases, and getting the chain run right, and then seeing if that puts the engine cases fairly central between the rails. Ultimately I want a Metmachex arm and Rgv rear wheel in this bike so I have to consider that too. I did think the 2 brackets that get welded in for the rear engine mount could be spaced wider than the engine mount itself, meaning I could shim either way to help with the chain run - maybe 5mm each way ? would obviously have to do something with the front spacers too. Having some sideways adjustability means there is some room for error which would be a good thing ! Also need to cut out another awkward bracket;
Hi With my white Hybrid finished, and my orange Hybrid close to completion, I had started thinking about the next project. ReggiePerrin was selling a project bike he had bought from oldelsieboy - a project that I was really tempted to buy when oeb listed it originally. At that time I was still deep into building both the Lc's so passed on it, but now have a bit more time. There is a back story to this. Back in the 80's I had various aircooled Rd's - mainly 400's, and I had built a Café Racer style 400E which I loved;
I sold it to a good friend of mine, who then sold it to his brother Ian, and he still has it. I had got Nigel Hill at Saxon Racing to Monoshock the frame which I then de lugged, Stan Stephens did the 430 conversion, I had the race seat modded with extra glass fibre that I then re shaped, and then fitted Pv wheels and forks' I always loved the blocky coffin tanks on the Rd's as they reminded me of the old Tz's a bit. I loved the idea of a pared down racer look a like, and that was as near as I could get at the time. I've built lots of different bikes since then, but I've never lost the urge for a café racer with a proper Tz tank, no side panels, minimal electrics hidden away as much as possible etc. So when Reggie decided to move this project on, I decided the time was right to scratch that Tz itch So, the project comprises an aircooled Rd frame with V5;
It's had a monoshock top mount welded in, and lots of standard bits cut off. It's missing the centre spar that the side stand bracket mounts too, so need to sort that, but it has had some mounting tubes welded on for an Lc rad. There are some mounting plates welded on in the seat area which could be useful for electrical gizmos. It will need a mount for the rear of the tank to fix to as well. This is the tank and seat unit;
I'm also going to borrow some Lc cases from Yamark to see whats needed to fit an Lc engine. I think the front mounts line up but the rear mounts will need work. Not sure on running gear yet. Lots to think about.
That was awkward as I couldn't get my angle grinder in there as it's quite a narrow gap. I bought a new Dremmel this week, so used that and got the job done. Also re shaped the right side engine bracket with the Dremmel;
The Lc/Pv engine only has one front mounting bolt as opposed to the mounts on an aircooled, so bottom mounting hole was redundant. Also had to make the bolt hole slightly larger as the Lc/Pv mounting bolt is a larger diameter than an AC. Next job will be to fit the rear end and try and find a happy place for the engine to sit, then I can plan some brackets.
Today I had a look at where the engine needs to sit in the frame. The noticeable difference between the Lc frame and AC frame downtubes is their width apart - the Lc tubes are more widely spaced. For the Lc engine to work in this frame, the exhausts will need to clear the downtubes, and it did look like it was going to be very close ! So I balanced the frame between 2 benches, and popped some Lc barrels onto the cases, and then fitted some ropey Lc Allspeeds I had to see how it would all line up. It's tight, but doable;
I took some basic measurements for the front spacers, which will be copper plumbing pipe for the time being, and it's a 6 inch on the left side and 3 inch on the right. I also need to find the right diameter bolt for the front mount to stop the sideways play the sloppy fit allows at the moment. Then I can look at where the rear mounts will need to be. Chain run will be secondary to positioning the engine - the exhausts are dictating where it will sit, but the good thing is that the engine looks more or less equal between the frame tubes and thus quite central. Ultimately, a Pv engine is going in - I won one today on ebay, and I have plans for a 392 Athena top end and Mutts' pipes, so I will need to check they will clear the down tubes too.
Well, we will see regards the engine. I've sent 3 messages via ebay now to see when I can pop over to pick it up but have had no reply ! I won it for £20 less than his buy it now price so wouldn't have thought he would have a problem with that. Maybe there is a genuine reason but it's 27 hours ago now On the plus side, my gamble on a £16 top yoke, originally for a Gsxr400 Gk73a, has paid off. It arrived tonight ?, and fits exactly the same as a VJ21 item would;
So that is a result. I will order new stanchions, springs, seals and oil this week so I can rebuild them.
I was in town today, and passing my local engineering guys, so popped in to say hello. Originally I was going to source all the steel plate for the engine brackets and other bits, but after speaking to them I am going to take the chassis and engine cases to them and get them to do it all. Will save me time, plus they have some awesome kit. I;ve been making some card templates so they will have patterns to work from. Just need to double check everything before I take it over - hopefully this week.
Post by donkeychomp on Jun 11, 2018 22:46:14 GMT 1
They are a great bunch of lads. I saw Clive this morning and did a quick sketch of a part I need for the truck. He loves fabricating stuff! He'll make the part and they will weld it on for me while I wait kinda thing. Like a drive through restaurant but with less burgers and more Argon...
I bumped into Glen, the welder, last week and he said they were enjoying a bit quieter time at the mo. It's gonna ramp up soon he said - not sure if there is a new film coming to Shepperton, but they do a lot of film and TV props and are usually very busy when the studios get a new contract.
And there a now a couple of Rd400e's on ebay !! I absolutely knew that once I cut the brackets off the frame a couple would appear, and of course they did !! Still tempted by an "E", and if I do I might move the latest Lc on - just haven't got enough room ! This frame will get dropped off this week though - just got to sort a few things out first to get it right
Frame is now at the Engineers getting it's first round of mods done. I mocked it up with Lc engine parts but the plan was always to go with a Pv bottom end. I won a 4CE complete motor on ebay and picked it up today;
Today I found the time to completely strip the motor I picked up yesterday. I won it on ebay - it was listed as a 31k, but the pics showed it was a 4ce (Brazil) model. As we know, this model engine doesn't allow a cable driven tacho, but that's not a problem as I plan on using a Scitsu or something like it. When I went to collect, it was missing the rotor and generator, which I did find in a box, although the wiring has been chopped. Again, the plan is for an Ignitech system so not really an issue. It also meant the engine strip down was a bit easier with no rotor to worry about ! I had a look up the ports when I first saw the engine, and the pistons looked new. I have been caught out with that before though so wasn't counting my chickens before I removed the head. But, it was great news;
I did notice there was no thermostat fitted ? Powervalves look very clean too and the pv jointing piece looks new. I think this engine has been rebuilt and not run since. Clutch looks mint too, and it all came apart easily;
All parts are now removed and bagged up. There was a broken bolt in the neutral switch, and an "easy out" wouldn't budge it so I drilled it out and re tapped to M5. The cases are now ready for vapour blasting. I'm planning on an Athena top end but standard crank, so 392cc. I was hoping the bottom end was gonna be good, and it's a bonus the top end is fresh, although I don't intend fitting it obviously The lack of pv's on the Athena set up will save having to squeeze a servo motor under the tank !
Today I did some work on the yokes. The VJ21 bottom yoke had the remains of the bottom bearing firmly stuck on. I cut a "V" into the offending item, allowing me to hit it with a drift and move it sideways - thus breaking the hold it had;
The lockstops will need cutting off at some point and new ones fitted. I also did some work on the Gsxr400 top yoke. There are 2 ally castings on the underside that got in the way when I tried to fit the Rgv clip ons;
Last job for now is to try and get the Pv ignition switch to fit. It's a bigger diameter than an Gsxr item, so the Dremmel was called in again to ream out the casting on the yoke. May still need work to the body of the switch - wont know until the yokes are fitted to the frame;
Cheers Mr K Hope to get the frame back this week. I'm hoping to use the tie bars on the engine to go to the bottom engine mounts on the AC frame. If It is doable, it will mean the tie bars being cut and rotated at one end, and possibly lengthened or shortened. There will be a couple of other frame mods too before I'm finished.
Cheers Andrew Yea, the engineering firm got really busy just after I dropped the frame off - maybe ready by Friday, or next week. Not in any major rush but I am keen to get all the frame mods done and then the rest is down to me. I found 2 tie bars today, so the next frame job will be to see if I can use the tie bars on the aircooled frame. I ordered some fork parts from Robinsons Foundry today - Suzuki oil seals, dust seals and spacer tubes. The tubes in my forks are different lengths and you can see they have been cut. 1 of the tubes has to come from Japan, so it's probably going to be a month before I get it all. In the meantime I am hoping to get the pv cases vapour blasted so I can start the bottom end rebuild. The other thing I did was to grind off the raised wording on the 3 spoke front wheel - it will look a lot cleaner once it's been powdercoated.