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Post by muttsnuts on Jun 10, 2013 18:39:13 GMT 1
Thought I'd post this up as its the 7th engine I've had in with the same fault in 9 months. All of the engines have had crank seal failure and all on the clutch side and all of the crank seals have been Yambit items, now it could be down to just poor workmanship on behalf of the person who fitted them originally, but having examined and compared the Yambit items with genuine Yamaha ones or the ones Norbo sell and the difference is plain to see. The Yambits one are as soft as sh*te and so tear really easy, see photo's below, the Geniune Yamaha ones and Norbos have a much stiffer construction and therefore far more durable, also, when fitting the seals its always good practice to use rubber grease during assembly or some grease/oil as a minimum and also take care when fitting. However, all that said, I'd recommend when you build an engine to use at least genuine crank seals where possible, it will pay for itself 10 fold in labour costs alone, let alone the hassle it causes to remove and strip the engine etc   When I get the engine out and stripped I'll take some better pictures Also, worth noting, the various symptoms are normally some or all of the following; 1. Right hand side exhaust smoking more then the left hand one (quiet a bit more) 2. Gearbox oil level dropping but no viisble oil leak 3. Won't rev past about 8k, also sluggish to rev quickly higher up the rev range 4. Crank case pressure when engine is running (remove dipstick to check), blowing oil out of the crank case breather As I say, it could some or all of the above, the engine I am doing now runs nice, but was smoking badly on the right hand exhaust and wouldn't rev easily above 8k HTH |
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Post by copper99 on Jun 10, 2013 20:40:55 GMT 1
Guttted for the owners of the bikes concerned, im glad I bought mine from Norbo.
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Post by muttsnuts on Jun 10, 2013 21:40:19 GMT 1
some more pictures of the failed seal, in fairness to Yambits stuff I do know of others who have used their seals with no issues, but its odd that the 7 concerned have all been from there   |
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Post by bryan on Jun 10, 2013 21:52:10 GMT 1
The Gen Yam ones are under £20 the pair so not that expesive, Ive not used anthing other than them, gaskets too.
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Post by billyboy on Jun 10, 2013 22:43:15 GMT 1
when i fitted my latest ones i noticed they 'pinched' at where the cases met (on both sides) iv'e never noticed this before and the bores were clean and smooth ,is this the reason for using a bit of grease on them ,or are you just using it on the inside diameter ?
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Post by billy on Jun 10, 2013 22:48:47 GMT 1
Amen brother! I'd rather use a USED original Yamaha seal than a new, cheap one that is made out of sh*t rubber!
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Post by nige on Jun 10, 2013 23:03:27 GMT 1
The yambits ones no cheaper! Will admit used yambits ones on my tzr 2 years ago with no probs ATM . Well lubed em before I fitted em though. Mind you I used their fork seals first time I changed em and they didn't last a year.
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kevbn2
L plate rider.
Posts: 43
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Post by kevbn2 on Jun 10, 2013 23:06:16 GMT 1
I bought my N2 2 weeks ago and the water pump seal went in two days but had receipt from seller from yambits dated April. it put so much oil out the overflow pipe i thought the shock had exploded!!! replaced now and put in uprated impeller.
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Post by garry1366 on Jun 11, 2013 0:02:09 GMT 1
Arrrggghhhhh I'll be rebuilding my motor soon and have a full set of new seals waiting to go in, you guessed it they're all from yambits. What should I do?
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Post by steeley on Jun 11, 2013 7:08:45 GMT 1
write them off ,buy some seals from norbo.recently went to a firm that sells seals they also make them.the guy was telling me they had to get a skip in to dump the seals they had in stock ,gone off,split ect.thousands of them.they order in now don't hold any.hmmm how long have those new crank seals been in my new parts box.
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Post by dusty350 on Jun 11, 2013 7:22:26 GMT 1
I only use genuine Yamaha seals and gaskets on my engine builds. Although these are simple engines, it would be a right pain to start a strip down just to change a pattern seal.Plus, the slightest air leak can be troublesome to say the least. Buy genuine and build once (hopefully  ) Dusty |
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Post by midlifecrisisrd on Jun 11, 2013 8:21:01 GMT 1
I will admit to using quality pattern gaskets on some builds ( not my 385 ) but would only use a gen yam in an area requiring major work to get to.
The same with seals. Crank, output shaft and water pump seam always genuine. Easy to change a shift shaft or kickstart seal but not anything requiring major stripping or potential blow up.
Yambits should be made aware of this if only for their quality control or future supplier choice.
Absolute nightmare for the owners of these bikes who thought they were doing the right thing and fully rebuilding engines.
Steve
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Post by Norbo on Jun 11, 2013 8:54:50 GMT 1
This is why I only do gen yam crank seals . thing is the made in china ones yambitz do are so cheep to get in its hard not to whant to get them as they make about a %300 mark up while the gen yam ones are %15,%20 max so I understand why he sells the cheepo stuff it makes so much more then the stuff I do.
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Post by bryan on Jun 11, 2013 9:13:36 GMT 1
Rebuilt Pauls (2cl) LC engine after just 40 miles when the crank was rebuilt with an under size centre shaft and twisted 26 degrees, just not worth re-using them at the cost, when a total engine strip is required to reolace them if they fail!
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Post by Delbert on Jun 11, 2013 13:45:54 GMT 1
Does anyone have any faith in anything from yambits ?? It seems that if someone has a problem , ie throttle sticking , first thing asked is,, is it from yambits ?? . Dosnt fill me with much confidence when all my stuff inc seals /gaskets,.rings, bearings , ect all came from yambits ,that said its been on the road for 2 years now ..
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Post by Denzil on Jun 11, 2013 21:04:14 GMT 1
Had the same problem, I mistakingly bought the complete seal kit from Yambits thinking they where Gen Yam!!!! this is when I first started before I joined the Forum. After having the above picture happening to me then i soon realised the error of my ways. The cost difference in comparison to Norbos is negligable anyway.
Gen Yam all the way for all internal engine parts or its just false economy.
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Post by bryan on Jun 11, 2013 22:29:00 GMT 1
and dont stock pile seals, just order them when you need them.
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Post by butchers on Jun 11, 2013 23:11:04 GMT 1
and dont stock pile seals, just order them when you need them. my spare seals are coated in Castrol rubber greases  |
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Post by muttsnuts on Jun 12, 2013 10:01:15 GMT 1
and dont stock pile seals, just order them when you need them. my spare seals are coated in Castrol rubber greases keep them well greased up with rubber grease and keep them in a dark place out of ultra violet light (sun light) then they will be fine, normally its a combination of the seals drying out and breaking down due to exposure to sun light that causes them to decay HTH |
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Post by steelerd on Jun 12, 2013 17:37:42 GMT 1
Ive had a fair few problems with some stuff of them to really sucks had some jets the other day that were to big for the 250 lc carbs ended up cleaning and re using the gen yam stuff, also had some switch stickers that were the wrong font, and a ignition red kill switch that was to big to fit into the switch, really hoping my seals not gone to as when i viewed the bike it seemed reluctant to rev past 8k but fingers crossed it was because it was chucking everything outta the base gaskets haha and had been seized at some point learn something new every day though  tom |
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Post by stanlc7189 on Jun 17, 2013 19:40:15 GMT 1
What's the first symptom of knackered seals? Mine are from Yambits I think, but no apparent problems so far, although the gearbox oil I changed recently looked a little milky, but I put that down to normal condensation. Could it be the seals I wonder?
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Post by Denzil on Jun 17, 2013 20:02:41 GMT 1
Excessive smoke on the right hand side engine. When mine was hot it would not stop smoking and then gearbox oil was all gone. This is when I knew I had a problem with the seals and the spending would commence. Sigh!!
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justyr
Thrash Merchant
Posts: 331
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Post by justyr on Jun 18, 2013 11:34:25 GMT 1
I had this very issue. Dodgy right side crank seal from Yambits cost me an unwanted 2nd engine rebuild.
I returned the faulty seal to them, but never heard anything back. On the basis of that, I only use them now if absolutely necessary. Their loss.
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Post by muttsnuts on Jun 18, 2013 12:46:43 GMT 1
What's the first symptom of knackered seals? Mine are from Yambits I think, but no apparent problems so far, although the gearbox oil I changed recently looked a little milky, but I put that down to normal condensation. Could it be the seals I wonder? that could be a weeping "O" ring for the water pipe that goes into the side casing, don't normally get milky oil with the crank seal failing, you normally get loads of smoke out of the right hand exhaust or pressure in the crankcases so it blows oil out of the breather etc I'd check the "O" ring and chnage it for the small cost it is, while the casing is off you can then check the crank seal to see if its all intact etc |
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Post by stanlc7189 on Jun 18, 2013 21:22:19 GMT 1
Cheers guys. I'll check the o-ring. Sounds like my crank seals are OK ( for now)
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Post by bryan on Jun 18, 2013 22:15:31 GMT 1
the clutch cover gasket goes round the water pipe, so should be there it could get in gearbox. The O ring stops water going outside the top engine case along the metal pipe under the right carb that the hose from the head goes on, I would think its the impela oil seal that could be the problem.
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Post by muttsnuts on Jun 19, 2013 3:09:38 GMT 1
the clutch cover gasket goes round the water pipe, so should be there it could get in gearbox. The O ring stops water going outside the top engine case along the metal pipe under the right carb that the hose from the head goes on, I would think its the impela oil seal that could be the problem. aye, and all of them too....... |
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Post by dt125man on Jun 19, 2013 10:29:32 GMT 1
I haved some fuel pipes off yam bits, it shrunk and went hard after 18 month.
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Post by jon on Jun 20, 2013 20:24:17 GMT 1
I really don't think there is anything majorly wrong with ALL Yambits products.
That said, I have also had bad experience with some of its products.
If you read their 'about us' section you will see that they mention 'best value parts'. Nothing about quality ... that is an assumption.
They do offer a very broad range of parts, which is good.
However, (unfortunately) it is down to the buyer to work out what QUALITY of part they need as a replacement.
They will quite happily sell you a seal (at almost Yamaha cost) that is inferior. However how many people know they are still available?
I would LOVE for someone (more familiar with the LC/YPVS than me ... my knowledge is Lambretta) to compile a list of critical (an where to get) parts. Obviously a pattern decal is not going to hurt anybody.
I would like to think they are unaware of the s..t quality (personal experience)seals they are selling.
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Post by jon on Jun 21, 2013 8:32:26 GMT 1
I've read my post again to see which part you diss agreed with ... And can only assume it is the part about 'down to the customer'. I'm not saying its the customers responsibility ... More that they have the choice of what to buy and from where.
It's forums like these where the knowledgable are educating others what to buy or not to buy from their experience.
I agree with everything others (and yourself) are saying. You amongst others (and myself) have said they will only fit genuine seals. That is you making a decision on quality.
What I was (and am) trying to say is like your bearing example some parts are less critical to work well even if they are not the best available.
I agree in an ideal world everying should not f..k up after five minutes. However it's a sad fact that many people are making and then selling s..t these days.
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