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Post by giggsy66 on Apr 12, 2023 7:24:23 GMT 1
I have been offered a 350lc but it’s in a 4L1 frame, would that put the resale desirability off if I sold it down the years?
Would it bother you guys?
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Post by mouse on Apr 12, 2023 7:32:11 GMT 1
That is such a subjective question.
If i was looking for a matching numbers bike, yes it would bother me. If i wasn't looking for a matching numbers bike then no, it wouldn't!
Mouse
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Post by headcoats on Apr 12, 2023 7:44:35 GMT 1
If doing an Hybrid I would say it doesn't matter but if doing a standard 350LC build then I think it would affect resale
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Post by JonW on Apr 12, 2023 8:24:58 GMT 1
If you 'must have' a matching numbers 350 then its a 'problem', but... well...
1, The LC 250 is 95+% the same as the 350 and the frame is exactly the same its just got stamped as a 250
2, For a bike you'll ride and enjoy, who cares what the frame and engine numbers are?
3, Im wondering as time goes on if the desire for matching nos 350s and 'uk supplied' etc perhaps will mark folks out as 'not really proper LC people' and just in it for investment? As 'The LC crowd' we have always been different having a more punk ethos, as such we didnt subscribe to the BS of rest of the biking world, sticking two fingers up etc. Even as a green bolt resto builder, I think we especially should be getting our fingers up and at the ready for the fuddy duddy classic bike/car scene as well. If we believe the best LC is in the camp of green bolt restos and matching numbers, we've sold out... surely?
4, It annoys me when people (mostly Fbers) discount a lovely 4L1 framed resto bike talking about as if its a ringer and someone is trying to scam the sale. Especially when they then fawn over some ropey 350 resto talking like its some kind of holy grail... er, they made thousands of em!*
5, I say that as these bikes were modded from day 1 and plenty of L plate 250s had 350 parts on em
6, For me, there is no good reason why a 250 frame bike should be any cheaper than a 350, yet that's how the market values it. Perhaps the smart money buys a 4L1 bike more cheaply and enjoys it just the same as a more exy 350, but for less money... and if its worth less later, well you paid less to start with so no worries.
As people know, I have bikes with both matching numbers and bitsas... and heaven forbid, I even have a 350 frame with a 250 engine in it! Does this make me a heathen or just an LC owner?
* - not every country got lots of 350s, in Aus they are rare... but never something like a limited edition etc.
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Post by dusty350 on Apr 12, 2023 9:46:07 GMT 1
Wouldn't, bother me in the slightest. My latest build is exactly that. We could all be dead by the time you would sell it, so don't worry about it !!
Seriously, if its good value for what it is, good tank, reliable engine etc, just get it bought and start enjoying it. The big ticket price bubble has deflated somewhat, so if you are looking for an investment, buy shares in a weapons manufacturer 😉😁
Dusty
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Post by shaunthe2nd on Apr 12, 2023 11:25:05 GMT 1
There's a lot been said on this topic before and if you search the threads you will find plenty of chat and opinion.
Luckily we are all a bit different and have different views which makes life interesting.
I'm happy to admit I'm a 'build it as San Yam did as he knew best' school of thinking.
Even when I was a teenager, I was different to all my mates who bought bikes and wanted to change them with after market exhausts, remove stands, cut mud-guards, chop indicators etc etc and all the other cool mods. I was always, am still am, keep it 100% stock.
So for me, that also means matching numbers, and the correct finishes, and period correctness.
Since I got back into 2-strokes 10 years ago I've rebuilt 1 per year, all have been matching numbers. A mix of RD AC's, LC's and YPVS, some starting with just frame & cases, others bought complete initially, and others somewhere in between.
For me. I love getting a bike bike as close as possible to how it left the factory. Not 100% possible as you can't get exactly same tyres and fluids etc, and some parts so difficult to get, but as close as possible.
I do build my bikes, and also ride them regulary, or some I do, so love the thrill of acting out my teens again.
I did buy a LC hybrid once, hoping I would be so thrilled with it that I'd start building hybrids as I admire some of the fantastic work some of the guy on here turn out. But no, whilst I enjoyed riding it, it never gave me the desire to build one, and if your heart isn't in it your not going to go out to your garage on a cold winters night to work on it.
In summary, buy and build or ride what you enjoy and can afford, don't worry about what others think or what the residual value is when your kids are clearing out the garage in years to come as they will have no idea anyway and will farm it out at half its real value. Oh and the tax man will take his 40% too.
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Post by midlifecrisisrd on Apr 12, 2023 12:07:48 GMT 1
As long as you aren't going for a concourse standard build it doesn't really matter (other than value)
Most important is the numbers and the V5
Frame number needs to be clearly visible and not tampered with
It also needs to match the v5
You might think that's obvious but you see frames/bikes for sale that state comes with UK v5 but number different. Eh, that's not the v5 for that bike 🙄
Biggest thing I'd say is check the engine capacity on the v5 is 347 as dvla are a bit tighter on changing this now
Steve
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Post by steve63 on Apr 12, 2023 12:55:51 GMT 1
If you are selling then yes, it's very important and obviously a matching numbers bike is worth more than a non matching one. Makes perfect sense. It proves that it's not been messed with and blown up and someone's not just dropped an engine in from a breakers.
If you are buying then no, of course it's not important. Why would you be expected to pay more for a matching numbers UK bike? What a load of rubbish. Doesn't prove a thing.
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Post by rigga on Apr 12, 2023 13:31:06 GMT 1
Depends .
Do you want to ride and experience an LC for what it is, or do you see it as an investment, and in £££ only?
If you pay top 350 money, then there is the likelihood you won't get the same money back if and when you sell, but if you pay what's reasonable, for a 350 in a 250 frame, then you won't.
But then it's all guesswork what these things are going to sell for in the future anyway, market may well have peaked, there's only so many over 50's willing to spend so much on a 40 plus year old bike. When those riders have stopped buying, who else will . Won't be the younger generation, they won't know what these bikes are.
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Post by 29davyt on Apr 12, 2023 16:10:59 GMT 1
You’ve not been offered a 350LC at all, you’ve been offered a 250LC with I imagine 350 cylinders fitted,,
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Post by chrisg on Apr 12, 2023 17:00:18 GMT 1
It would not bother me, BUT it should be reflected in the price.
A 4L0 350 is always going to be more expensive than a 4L1 350 conversion.
It really gets my goat when you see people trying to pass 4L1 350s as original rd350lc's and at 4L0 money 🤬
If its cheap enough, go for it. It will still make you grin.
Find out what was actually changed. Was it just the cylinders,head and pistons or full conversion?
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Post by giggsy66 on Apr 12, 2023 17:50:58 GMT 1
You’ve not been offered a 350LC at all, you’ve been offered a 250LC with I imagine 350 cylinders fitted,, Engine number is 4L0 and log book states 347cc |
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Post by giggsy66 on Apr 12, 2023 17:54:11 GMT 1
It would not bother me, BUT it should be reflected in the price. A 4L0 350 is always going to be more expensive than a 4L1 350 conversion. It really gets my goat when you see people trying to pass 4L1 350s as original rd350lc's and at 4L0 money 🤬 If its cheap enough, go for it. It will still make you grin. Find out what was actually changed. Was it just the cylinders,head and pistons or full conversion? £6k uk bike in mint condition 16000 miles |
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Post by 29davyt on Apr 12, 2023 17:59:09 GMT 1
It’s worth that if it’s as nice as you say and got the 4L0 motor in it,
does it have the 350 rear wheel, correct exhausts etc?
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Post by shaunthe2nd on Apr 12, 2023 18:03:17 GMT 1
£6k sounds good to me. If it was 4L0 matching numbers UK bike prob £10-12k so good value.
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Post by loctite on Apr 12, 2023 18:39:29 GMT 1
The holey grail would be matching numbers with full history now your talking big bucks,not seen one for sale for along time now.
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Post by giggsy66 on Apr 12, 2023 18:51:45 GMT 1
It’s worth that if it’s as nice as you say and got the 4L0 motor in it, does it have the 350 rear wheel, correct exhausts etc? What’s the difference with the 250 & 350 wheel? It has aftermarket exhausts on. |
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Post by 29davyt on Apr 12, 2023 18:54:11 GMT 1
Cush drive on 350
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Post by shaunthe2nd on Apr 12, 2023 19:06:14 GMT 1
Sprockets too.
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Post by giggsy66 on Apr 12, 2023 19:10:47 GMT 1
How can I tell by looking at it? |
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Post by shaunthe2nd on Apr 12, 2023 19:26:15 GMT 1
Hard to describe. The 250 sprocket is fixed direct to the wheel by 5 or 6 studs that are rubber inset into the rear wheel. The 350 is different and you can see the sprocket is fixed to a separate casting that then mounts into the inner wheel hub. In between are the cush rubbers but you won't see them.
Hope that makes sense or someone with better descriptive prowse comes along soon!
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Post by shaunthe2nd on Apr 12, 2023 19:28:09 GMT 1
The 250 wheel is lighter too that's why a lot of proddie racers fitted them to their 350s
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Post by dusty350 on Apr 12, 2023 19:45:02 GMT 1
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Post by shaunthe2nd on Apr 12, 2023 19:46:09 GMT 1
Oh I forgot, the 350 is yellow! :-)
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Post by 4l04ever on Apr 12, 2023 20:13:34 GMT 1
Oh I forgot, the 350 is yellow! :-) Matching the dot on the oil pump ;-) |
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Post by 29davyt on Apr 12, 2023 21:13:59 GMT 1
If you’ve got any pictures of the bike stick them up on here
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Post by donkeychomp on Apr 12, 2023 21:19:05 GMT 1
Did someone mention a full service history?  Alex |
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Post by veg on Apr 12, 2023 21:24:24 GMT 1
10 years ago we weren’t really having this conversation we were just into having lc’s there were some after matching numbers green passivate but the vast majority of us didn’t care. However at that time they hadn’t caught on again and supply out stripped demand they were still relatively cheap. Most had plentiful supply of spares, we were giving stuff away for free and helping each other out.
Today the market is very different lots of new comers and demand has out stripped supply. I often wonder how many are true enthusiast’s and who are in it for investment etc. I’ve met a few ‘owners’ who couldn’t tell their Yokohamas from Dunlops.
Most on here though are old school enthusiasts or new to the fold but just get it. I never venture onto FB as it’s full of t**ts spouting bollocks and trying to impress others rarely do they last on here.
I guess where I’m coming from is, why do you want one? Investment purposes? Cause you had one as a kid and want to tear arse around pretending you’re 18 again?
If you’re after investment buy the very best matching numbers don’t use it as it’ll devalue it, if you’re 18 again buy the best you can afford concentrating on the motor (rebuild, receipts, reputable builder) don’t worry unduly about the cosmetics as long as the tank is sound. Rag it and enjoy it for what it is, a slow, bad handling under braked slice of teenage heaven that’ll have you grinning from ear to ear and forget about the value, memories are made of experiences not whether something is a good investment, you won’t be on your death bed worrying about a return but you could be laying there thinking feck that was fun.
Apologies to those who seek out the green passivate nirvana you’re still alright. 😁👍
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Post by JonW on Apr 13, 2023 0:31:51 GMT 1
Im sure there was a full run down of the diffs between a 250 and 350 LC on here plenty of times and also maybe on Xaviers site?
sounds like a good value bike to me at 6k if its nice. But what has been done and how much is 350? If the owner cant tell you... well...
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Post by giggsy66 on Apr 13, 2023 7:32:23 GMT 1
If you’ve got any pictures of the bike stick them up on here How do I add pics? |
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