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Post by dusty350 on Jan 19, 2014 17:44:02 GMT 1
Oops, Forgot to mention the filters. Not sure why the previous owner did that. The Y boot I intend to fit will end up in the same position as those K&N'S are at the mo, but there is plenty of room under the tank for it as there is no airbox.
Dusty
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Post by AndyYam on Jan 20, 2014 12:54:06 GMT 1
Cheers dusty will keep an eye out. You should be ok with paypal. They will always return your money. I'm having a few problems at the moment where i bought an engine forks and wheels for one of my enduros and the seller turned out to be a conman and just stole the money. 100 was sent through paypal and ive got tht back but 250 went via bank transfer and im now dealing with Action Fraud and 2 different police forces to try and get my money back.
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Post by dusty350 on Jan 20, 2014 17:33:02 GMT 1
Blimey Andy, that's rough. Hope you get your money back. Ideally I want to keep the panels but not at the price I paid for them as they are now damaged. They match the tank and the paintwork is pretty good, and, unbelievably, the mounting tabs, although poking out of the bubble wrap when I got them, are intact. You don't see panels come up often, so if I can get some money back to reflect the damage, I will be happier.
Regards
Dusty
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Post by dusty350 on Jan 21, 2014 19:26:02 GMT 1
Hi Had a bit of time today, so I decided to strip the seat unit down; I was keen to get it apart so I could have a better look at the subframe; There are a lot of parts that make up the seat unit. I wondered why it was so heavy !! My plan now is a bit clearer. I will use the standard subframe on the bike, and keep the rear underseat section which is part of the mudguard and doubles as a storage box; I have cut down the left side panel, to match the right shorter panel, and this means I will not use the front part of the mudguard. This would have exposed the battery holder which is not needed, and also would have fouled the reservoir on the Cbr600 shock; I will be able to mend the broken connecting strips on the new panels I bought, and the seller has said he will re imburse me some of the money I paid for them. I will wait and see if that happens ! Dusty
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Post by AndyYam on Jan 22, 2014 16:22:54 GMT 1
That sounds like a fair outcome. Shame they got damaged in the first place though. will the CBR shock not fit without mods then? I'm wondering about what shock to go for on mine and was looking at either R6 or cbr600rr.
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Post by dusty350 on Jan 22, 2014 18:15:44 GMT 1
Hi Andy, He's not paid me yet so we'll see. The Cbr600rr shock needs less work than others I believe. I did a bit of research on the net as to what others have fitted. Ideally you need an eye at the top and a fork at the bottom. The eye is narrower than a 4dl I believe and needs shimming with washers. The reservoir clears the subframe downtube, but if I left the lower mudguard/battery box on the bike it would have fouled it. I wanted an "open" look under the seat and trimming back the left side panel and losing the lower mudguard helps to achieve that. Have you done anymore with yours yet ?
Dusty
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Post by AndyYam on Jan 23, 2014 4:33:06 GMT 1
No unfortunately not. It's still sitting in the garage with the 4dl bottom end in. Me and my girlfriend are in the process of buying our first house so its hectic times. But once we're in i'll have my own garage so will be able to make good progress. I'm sure they'll be other things to sort out but she'll struggle to keep me out of that garage!
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Post by dusty350 on Jan 23, 2014 8:02:39 GMT 1
Always a balancing act, between doing your jobs in the house, and getting some garage time ! Good luck with the move. Dusty
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Post by dusty350 on Jan 29, 2014 17:05:08 GMT 1
Hi, Raining all day here, so I thought I would tidy the shed and make a bit more room for the teezer, for when I find time to do a few bits. I'm planning on taking the pipes off and seeing if my F2 TSA's are anywhere near likely to fit, and I've got the room to do it now. Also got £40.00 back off the seller of the side panels for the damage in transit, so happy about that. The damaged part is now going to be cut off anyway, to look like the red panel I tried out previously. I have a vinyl sign shop near me, and I took a panel in to see if he could redo the decals. Gonna be a bit of a job, but there are decals on ebay for £30.00, which is cheaper and easier, so the money I got back will pay for them. I will do some pics soon.
Dusty
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Post by dusty350 on Jan 30, 2014 14:14:02 GMT 1
Hi Crappy weather here again, so had a fiddle with betty in the shed !! First thing I wanted to do was take the pipes off. The normal pipe is the bottom pipe from a pair of Micron Gp pipes. The bracket that bolts it to the original Gp pipe that sits above it has been removed, and another bracket welded on in it's place to mount it to the frame; I think parts of the other Micron were used for the short pipe, but there has been a lot more metal added to get it to this; Unbelievable amount of work really to make such an ugly pipe . As I said before, I can only imagine it was meant to hide within a fairing. This is the configuration when they're on the bike; With the pipes off, I used a torch to peer up the exhaust ports. Couldn't get a good enough photo, but the bores look good, and I can see honing marks on the barrels. The part of the combustion chambers on the head that I could see looked good too. Engine certainly ran well enough. I then took 1 of the TSA's off my Yamasaki and offered it up; Not far out really. A bracket moved would see it fit I reckon. The big issue will be the other side due to the side stand mount. I had the same problem on my old Tzr350, and a previous owner had spaced out the mount for the stand. I wont know until I can get to the Yamasaki's other pipe to remove it and offer it up, but I expect it to snag the stand mount. More soon. Dusty
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Post by dusty350 on Jan 30, 2014 15:00:57 GMT 1
With the pipes off, I could have a better look underneath. The tie bars have been used, and lugs were welded to the frame at the back, rather than the front end of the engine to connect them to the frame. Spacers were also used to drop them down an inch or so to help get them to fit; Not so neat was this solution to keep the kickstart in place; I'll think of a different, neater answer for the kickstart ! Dusty
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Post by fatfastroger on Jan 30, 2014 18:55:22 GMT 1
I wonder how it ran with those pipes, as they look to be quite different diameters to each other, even if you could stretch them straight. Looks like a custom build from Kenny might be in order :-) Looks a million times less ugly with pipes off.
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Post by dusty350 on Jan 30, 2014 19:17:58 GMT 1
Hi, I haven't ridden the bike, but the previous owner had it on the road, and said it went well, although it had a flat spot around 5-6k revs, which could be pipes, filters or both. It is a shame that so much work went into a pipe that was so ugly. It must have taken a long time to measure and make, but it wont be going back on the bike. The side stand will be the difficult part I think, and it's not for no reason that a lot of these 4dl 350's have pipes that both exit on the right side. I would still prefer one pipe each side though. Kenny's would be my first choice as they are fantastic pipes, and with the 31k carbs and y boot, it will hopefully run well. The de-uglyfication of betty continues ! Dusty
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matt7
Thrash Merchant
Smell of the 2 stroke & the roar of the crowd
Posts: 445
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Post by matt7 on Jan 30, 2014 21:58:28 GMT 1
You're getting well stuck in Dusty Snake charmer exhaust ? Just because you can, doesn't mean you should !
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Post by dusty350 on Jan 31, 2014 10:13:57 GMT 1
Haha, you're right there Matt ! I imagine there must be quite a mismatch in the way each pipe works, and I wonder if the builder understood anything about 2 stroke expansion chambers ? The pipe issue is what's stopping me tearing the whole bike down and starting again. I know that if there are no patterns for pipes to suit this frame/engine configuration, then it means the bike going off to the pipe builder, and there are no funds for that at the mo . I think maybe the pipe issue stopped a lot of people from bidding on it, due to the weird looking nature of them and replacement costs. I don't regret buying it though, and I've spent less than £200. so far and improved quite a few areas. One good thing is that the fact I'm not stripping it down completely means I can fiddle around with lots of smaller issues. The cut down side panels exposed the mudguard/battery holder, which wasn't meant to be on show. The battery lives under the tank; The guard also fouls the Cbr shock, so I was happy to modify it. The rear section doubles as a mudguard and a storage box, accessed by a lockable flap at the rear. This box needs to stay as lots of parts bolt to it; With the side panels fitted, you can only see the box from underneath, but it still didn't look right if I left it like that. So I took the part of the mudguard I didn't need, roughly cut off the battery holder part, and tidied up the section that bolts to the storage box; This will soften the look of the box when fitted, plus add a bit more protection from crud off the wheel; And fitted to the subframe; Dusty
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Post by ringdingding on Jan 31, 2014 12:06:36 GMT 1
I'd guess the original builders thinking when making that second 'snake charmer' pipe was to try and retain the look of a single cylinder TZR. I'm sure Kenny at TSA has made these pipes for a few people now using 4DL, 4FL or 3MA frames. The problem will be that everyone will be using different rear sets and swing arms, therefore no simple set pipe design. I've just got back to building mine, it started many years ago with a subframe and brackets from Slinger before he moved to Canada. I keep looking at the huge heavy plastic box and know it needs to come off. A one off alloy subframe is the route of choice but expensive and then you would probably be using race fibreglass which won't last. Vins version of the same bike is a lovely solution, I think he went with a Honda RS tail. I also looked at the Chinese panel kits which some say are acceptable and some say are rubbish, thinking maybe make the subframe to suit a 3XV kit. The way I looked at it, if you're building a light relatively powerful bike then you need to make it as light as you can, and make it brake and handle as well as you can. Then you've got yourself an individual bike that given the right bumpy twisty B road will be very entertaining.
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Post by dusty350 on Jan 31, 2014 12:57:04 GMT 1
Hi, I did think long and hard about the seat/subframe combo, and trawled the net for pics of different versions. I did originally want to use what it came with but with a different seat to the 916 version fitted. I have no fabrication equipment or skills, so anything subframe wise would have had to be outsourced, which costs money. Then there was the issue of race fibreglass being durable enough for road use, comfort, paintwork to match, etc etc, so just doing the rear end of the bike was gonna start costing big bucks . The decision to go standard was thus quite an easy one really. As it stands, I can do or get everything done locally except for the pipes which will be the big issue. I emailed Kenny and he will need the bike to make the pipes, which is understandable, but ultimately means the strip down and real renovation work is a long way off. I will do little bits and bobs that can be removed and left off the bike though. As for the box, it is big and heavy, but if I want to keep the standard back end the box has to stay. Plus side is as I'm gonna premix this bike, I will have somewhere for my oil, plus sandwiches, deckchair, small suitcase, tent and the springer spaniel for days out !! Any pics of your build ? Dusty
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Post by huggy76 on Jan 31, 2014 18:05:33 GMT 1
Shame they have cut up an early set of GP pipes, think I'm right in saying they are early ones as they have one piece end cans (better looking cans) and no flat plate on the lower pipe.
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matt7
Thrash Merchant
Smell of the 2 stroke & the roar of the crowd
Posts: 445
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Post by matt7 on Jan 31, 2014 18:23:14 GMT 1
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Post by dusty350 on Jan 31, 2014 21:01:11 GMT 1
Hi, I've been following that thread and have seen that beautiful Tz. The seat is a lot like those on the bikes on the first page of this thread, and suits the Tzr well I think.
Dusty
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Post by gazbeemer on Feb 1, 2014 0:06:13 GMT 1
Sometimes with I bought a tzr lol. Parts seem so much more available
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Post by dusty350 on Feb 2, 2014 22:43:17 GMT 1
Hi, Parts for this Belgarda model aren't filling up pages on Ebay Uk, but there seems to be a lot more available on Ebay Germany I'm hoping I wont need to buy too many 4dl parts though. Today I took some time to clean up the plastic parts that make up the rear mudguards and numberplate holder; I will get some replacement stainless bolts and washer to re-assemble the rear guards. I also have some straight indicators to replace the wobbly ones fitted. Dusty
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gringo
Thrash Merchant
Posts: 378
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Post by gringo on Feb 2, 2014 23:00:51 GMT 1
Dusty, nice thread mate, watching with interest, keep the faith you know your going to build something that is going to be special Gringo
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Post by dusty350 on Feb 3, 2014 7:40:04 GMT 1
Hi Gringo, Cheers mate. The parts were taken to work and scrubbed clean in the BA room sink !! I've done a fair bit of renovation work at work over the years, and lots of parts have been sprayed in my makeshift spray booth in the boiler room !! Dusty
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Post by AndyYam on Feb 3, 2014 17:16:22 GMT 1
Good work Dusty. Nice to see it coming along. I'm still waiting for my house move to be sorted but then will be able to start stripping and exhanging info. I'll definitly be after some more detialed photos and measurements if possible with regards to the engine mounting. If I make quick progress and end up being ready for pipes before you then we can compare mounting points etc and theres always the possibility that where ever i go to get some made can make you a set at the same time. I will be having pipes made its just a matter of time for me.
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Post by AndyYam on Feb 3, 2014 17:19:13 GMT 1
One other thing I've been considering is swing arm bushes etc. Have you found anywhere you can get them from at a reasonable price? I'm not sure how mine are but I'm going to be powder coating my frame and swing arm so will need new ones. Not sure what links and documents you have but heres a few bits ive collected: parts.takaoka-vl.ru/?make=yamaha&model=663tzr125.co.uk/tzr-125-r-and-rr-4dl-92-98-parts.phpI've just noticed he has ne panels and battery cover on there. This could get expensive!
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Post by dusty350 on Feb 3, 2014 17:43:48 GMT 1
Hi Andy, When you are ready, just let me know what measurements/photo's you need and I'll sort them for you. Mine had the frame modded to sit the engine further back, but others I have seen on the net haven't done that. Regards pipes, I did email Kenny as they would be my preference, but he will need the bike at his place for measurements etc, which will be a bit of a stumbling block. Then again, I didn't expect to buy them off the shelf, and I understand why Kenny needs the bike. The other option is that I have Mark Dent living and working just down the road from me, and I've seen his pipes on an Rg500, and they were stunning too, but I haven't got in touch with him yet. I will try the other F2 TSA on the Tzr to see how it fits, and Kenny suggested that a 3ma stand bolts up differently to a 4dl, which might make life easier. I'm picking up info on these here and there so happy to share any knowledge.
Regards
Dusty
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Post by dusty350 on Feb 5, 2014 14:04:53 GMT 1
Hi, Finished nights this morning and raining again ! So, down the shed then One thing had been bugging me a bit. I had offered up the Cbr shock against the bike the other day, and the very rough guesstimate looked like the subframe's central support would interfere with the shock reservoir. I had seen this mod done on another forum but didn't know if the subframe needed altering, so time to find out for sure. This is the Cbr shock next to the Paoli Tzr item; Virtually the same length so that's good. The bottom fork internal width is the same as the Tzr, but the mounting hole needs opening up slightly as the Tzr bolt is bigger, so that's an easy fix on the pillar drill; The top mount bolt is the same, so no drilling required but it will need some shims as the eye of the shock is a lot narrower than the Tzr; So it really is a virtually bolt on shock (thankfully). And the subframe does clear it with room to spare; The fact the shocks are the same length means the dog bones don't need altering. I did notice the dog bones have 3ma marked on them, so presume all the linkages are the same. The bearings seemed good in the linkages too, so that's a relief ! Dusty
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Post by dusty350 on Feb 5, 2014 14:13:18 GMT 1
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Post by AndyYam on Feb 5, 2014 17:09:59 GMT 1
Well thats great news about the shock Dusty. I hope you dont mind me stealing all your ideas! Would the battery tray have been in the way if it wasnt cut away? Also, what are you doing with the vapour unit? I've also got a wr200 that I should be working on aswell and it might be a nice replacement for the speedo on that if you were looking to sell it?
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