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Post by paddyontour on Jul 7, 2011 12:14:10 GMT 1
Hi all - The battery on my F2 isn't charging and as far as I can work out, all the tests from the Haynes book of lies are failing  I've disconnected the '4 way connector under the tank' and performed the multi-meter testing between the '4 white wires' and I get no results from anything, no resistance and no continuity between any of the connections (I've even tried testing between each of the white wires and the blue one in the little 4 wire connector block) The bike has a brand new loom, Battery & regulator and I had fitted a zeel just before this happened (coincedence?) - but I've now tried it with all the original Yamaha electrikery including the battery & original reg. on there and it's still the same  Am I doing something wrong or what exactly am I looking for on my multi-meter as it seems like no matter what I set it to, I get nothing from any of the white wires coming from the stator? - the meter isn't a crap one and works fine for any other testing I've tried? HELP! |
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Eyeore
L plate rider.
Posts: 31
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Post by Eyeore on Jul 7, 2011 13:05:07 GMT 1
Try further down the circuit, sounds like somethings come un plugged
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Post by paddyontour on Jul 7, 2011 13:30:59 GMT 1
That's sorta part of the problem, the cable some out of the top of the engine and straight up to the connectors under the tank, no joins etc. in-between... I've removed the left side cover, but you can't really get in at anything easily as it's all behind the flywheel!  |
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paulo
Thrash Merchant
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Post by paulo on Jul 7, 2011 21:34:26 GMT 1
Hi m8, I'm taken it you've done a DC volt meter check across the battery to check generated voltage - should be 14.5 +/-0.5 volts at 2,000 revs. If you're not getting this then next step is checking the resistance (ohms) between the white wires coming from the stator - i only know a little about the wiring arrangement on a 31K - not sure if F2 is the same ?.
x3 white wires & x1 blue (earth) at the plug, check between all x3 white wires, should get 0.4ohms +/-20%. If your getting nothing and the connector block looks OK and you have a good earth,then most likely the stator unit or a break somewhere in the wiring down over. Hope this helps a little m8.
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Post by paddyontour on Jul 8, 2011 13:09:07 GMT 1
I'm not getting 14.5 @ 2K - it doesn't seem to fluctuate at all when revving and I'm getting nothing at the 3 white wires in the 4 way connector block under the tank, no readings at all  I've even taken the pins out of the block, re-cut the wires and then soldered the pins back on to make sure I've got a good connection at that point ! s'pose I'll have to take the left hand cover off again and try to get in at the connectors 'on the other end' - in behind the flywheel! Cheers for the reply bud  |
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paulo
Thrash Merchant
Posts: 406
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Post by paulo on Jul 8, 2011 20:47:35 GMT 1
Yes looks like next step is left hand casing off. Maybe pin prick each white wire at the stator in turn with tester to confirm continuity of each wire, this will confirm no breaks in the wire length. If that shows OK, then looking like the stator is at fault - is every thing else working on the bike, lights etc - checked all fuses ?.
Just checked mine out as engines currently in bit, getting readings of 0.6ohms across all the combination of the x3 white wires, so if your getting nothing then looking more and more like the stator, that's if there's nothing obvious with the wiring.
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Post by mellow on Jul 9, 2011 11:34:45 GMT 1
urs seems a bit high then paulo o.4 +/- 20% is 0.48 max  |
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paulo
Thrash Merchant
Posts: 406
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Post by paulo on Jul 9, 2011 21:58:26 GMT 1
Now know why its showing high, my stator is the later F2 type , which i believe should show 0.44 - 0.66ohms according to Haynes - not bad for a 20yr old test meter. The ones we use at work, normally need re-calibrating each year as they fall over the +/-10% tolerance we need to work to, and they're top notch units.
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Post by nikfubar on Jul 9, 2011 22:08:37 GMT 1
There is no connectors at the stator end, the wires are soldered directly on the coils. Best get a flywheel puller so you can check it out.
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Post by paddyontour on Jul 12, 2011 0:04:05 GMT 1
have you put the meter on AC mate when checking the white wire voltage.... never had coils fail ever!! should be around 20 volts AC so if your meter is on DC you WONT get a reading.... ;D Bloody good idea - never thought of that ;D although, you mention coils, I assume you mean the 'coils' in the stator assembly thingy? |
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Post by paddyontour on Jul 16, 2011 14:56:33 GMT 1
right... got some time to do some more tests... The battery is fully charged and showing 14.8v - this is whether the bike is running or not... I stuck pins into the three white wires (see piccy) down inside the left engine casing/cover and tested them for continuity back to the 4-block connector under the tank and the all test OK  So, with the bike running I connected the Negative lead from my meter to the earth on the bike and tested each of the white wires in turn, the results I get are not what I expected I get about 8V on one, 5v on another & around 3.5-4v on the last one? - I've tested them with the bike ticking over, @2000rpm & blipping the throttle and the voltage readings only change very slightly - I've also tested the voltage on AC & DC and the results are the same? Am I just being a numpty here and completely missing the plot  or does it look like the coils (or whatever they're called ) are knackered |
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paulo
Thrash Merchant
Posts: 406
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Post by paulo on Jul 16, 2011 19:54:31 GMT 1
Hi m8, going off the step by step procedure in the workshop manual:-
1. Check for generated voltage @ battery.
2. Check resistance across the stator three white wires
if no readings @ the stator wires, then replace.
As before, checked mine out and got readings, if your not getting anything then looking very likely its the stator coil.
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Post by cb250g5 on Jul 16, 2011 22:54:13 GMT 1
So, with the bike running I connected the Negative lead from my meter to the earth...... The 3 phase alternator is not earthed you need to measure AC voltage across any 2 of the 3 white wires, and then test the next pair etc. When this AC is rectified, the -ve of the DC output is then connected to the bikes frame as earth. |
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Post by paddyontour on Jul 26, 2011 18:40:20 GMT 1
The 3 phase alternator is not earthed you need to measure AC voltage across any 2 of the 3 white wires, and then test the next pair etc. When this AC is rectified, the -ve of the DC output is then connected to the bikes frame as earth. Cheers for the info bud - haven't been able to get anything done one the bike for ages now as I errr, well, emmmm - well, I fell into a lake while fishing and pulled the muscles in me left tit - but I won't go into the details here and now anyway - tested all 3 possible combinations on 'the three white wires' with the meter set to AC and I get 2.5.v -- 5.5v -- 10v these are approximite values as the meter was fluctuating a little... hmmmm - logic dictates the coils are knackered surely but do they go tits up? |
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Post by cb250g5 on Jul 26, 2011 23:12:30 GMT 1
The 3 phase alternator is not earthed you need to measure AC voltage across any 2 of the 3 white wires, and then test the next pair etc. When this AC is rectified, the -ve of the DC output is then connected to the bikes frame as earth. Cheers for the info bud - haven't been able to get anything done one the bike for ages now as I errr, well, emmmm - well, I fell into a lake while fishing and pulled the muscles in me left tit - but I won't go into the details here and now anyway - tested all 3 possible combinations on 'the three white wires' with the meter set to AC and I get 2.5.v -- 5.5v -- 10v these are approximite values as the meter was fluctuating a little... hmmmm - logic dictates the coils are knackered surely but do they go tits up? Measure the resistance across each pair - should be basically short circuit - sounds like you may have a duff coil. Or maybe your magnetic rotor has lost its magnetism - happens on old Lucas ones. |
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Post by paddyontour on Aug 18, 2011 13:08:11 GMT 1
Right... This bleedin saga continues... Managed to get me hands on a set of coils which all tests pass on - lovely... Bought a flywheel holding tool thing, got the nut off the flywheel (eventually!)... Screwed a brand new - never used - flywheel puller into the flywheel, met quite a bit of resistance in trying to pull the flywheel off and in the process of 'giving it some' the f**kin flywheel puller sheared off - grrrrrrr - not the bit that screws into the flywheel itself, but the threaded 'bolt' which runs down the centre to push against the crank in order to pull the flywheel off... just to add insult to injury, when it snapped I head butted the frame and ripped the 5h1t out of the back of me hand... so I just had to walk away before I started to hit the bitch with a torque wrench... so, this morning I have an egg on my forehead and a very sore right hand (no, not from extra curricular midnight activities - lol) , in addition to a flywhel puller now stuck in the flywheel and a valvie which is no nearer getting sorted... oh, there'll be more on this I reckon... Just thought I'd post this so that anyone who is on the verge of giving up can see that they're not the only one who wonders 'why do I bother with these LC's' - lol enjoy! |
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Post by mellow on Aug 18, 2011 16:00:42 GMT 1
did you give the centre part of the puller a "tap" with a hammer once you had screwed it in and it touched crank |
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Post by paddyontour on Aug 18, 2011 17:13:13 GMT 1
did you give the centre part of the puller a "tap" with a hammer once you had screwed it in and it touched crank I tapped it with a rubber mallet, as the book of lies says to do so... but I was afraid to hit it too hard or use a hammer in case I damaged the spline (or whatever it's called!) coming out of the crank? Should I have given it a 'good whack' kinda thing? I'm gonna attack it again tonight and get the puller outta there and get a new puller and try again... Unless anyone has any suggestions, as I'm well up for suggestions ;D |
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Post by Bazille on Aug 18, 2011 19:37:44 GMT 1
Dont bother with a rubber mallet, you need a proper hammer and the shock of the blow should seperate the taper and it will come free!!
colin
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Post by mellow on Aug 18, 2011 20:57:15 GMT 1
i use a normal hammer just a sharp blow,not a full swing with a club hammer ;D |
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Post by paddyontour on Aug 18, 2011 21:43:38 GMT 1
Cheers for the replies - guess it's gonna get a tap (or a smack if I can't sort it soon!) of a hammer then! Got me kids tonight so probably won't get a chance... but I'll post up the next chapter in this little saga as soon as I get some time to work on the bike again thx |
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paulo
Thrash Merchant
Posts: 406
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Post by paulo on Aug 19, 2011 21:20:48 GMT 1
Hi mate, not having much luck at the moment with that bike of yours - your most likely thinking it's cursed or something.
Yeah, as others have said, nip up, whack end with hammer to shock off, but if it's been on for years a spray with some WD40 and left over night could help too - as they can be corroded on.
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Post by paddyontour on Aug 23, 2011 0:44:10 GMT 1
She Lives!!! ;D ;D ;D
I got the flywheel off, put new coils on and she's flyin' again - well chuffed doesn't begin to describe it!
Thanks for all the help and suggestions - got there in the end and all the grief is forgotten now, been out for a good rip and now it's time to put the Zeel back on and smile me tits off again ;D
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Post by drew1967 on Aug 23, 2011 6:57:08 GMT 1
Glad you're sorted. Hope I can get my gremlins out of my garage soon.
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or does it look like the coils (or whatever they're called 
