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WTF???
Oct 19, 2017 15:18:16 GMT 1
Post by fozzy17 on Oct 19, 2017 15:18:16 GMT 1
if only it took 40hrs to restore a bike... I spent more than that cleaning, cataloging, searching for parts! Engine rebuilt is 600quid? seals, bearings, cranks, pistons, rebore, oil and waters, pump to Arrow... oops... ive blown the budget! Anyway, Im not siding with the seller, it does seen excessive at 14k, but I know a bloke here who spent that on his LC4 in AUD, and some might argue that there was more he could have done. NOS parts and paint were his big costs, and he did a fair chunk of the work himself... no one restores of these to get rich. crank £350 exchange rebore £45 x2 £90 engine gasket kit £45 inc seals piston £50 x2 £100 gearbox bearing £50 pump service £60
and that's if it needs a new crank, maybe perfectly serviceable so its not far off 600 plus labour
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Post by JonW on Oct 19, 2017 23:46:33 GMT 1
Ok, Im not trying to start anything but you obviously get better deals than me or start with better engines lol ...and maybe I just pay more for stuff, but thats normal being donwunder. I'd use your estiamte as a best case really, the worst case is usually where i start with my projects as It works out closer to my estimate in the end sadly...
This is the kind of ballpark costings I work to as I replace pretty much anything that wears in a motor along with almost every screw, nut or bolt, holder or clip with new or replated items.
Crank new OEM ypvs with shipping about 425 - almost always the cranks i get are toast. new bearings 100 with shipping new seals 50 with shipping (I'll stop saying this now as all parts have to be shipped to Aus at silly rates so lets assume every item includes costs for that...) gaskets (always with OEM head and base gaskets) 65 Threebond 1211 - I seem to need a new one for every motor unless you do it weekly LOL 30 oil 40 water 40 pistons 100 rebore 100-150 new shift shaft 35 replating of screws / nuts (or new ones) 50 (more if you need new head nuts) Arrow pump 60 oil pipes and clips and holders 20 plugs, caps if needed etc etc etc ...and almost always a set of clutch plates and I like to fit a easy shift thingy and a pancake bearing for the clutch as well. And lets not even start about PVs... new seals and usually holders, clips and joiner if not whole new ones. And then there are the ripped out oversized nasty exhaust studs to be fixed, the lapping of the inlets where the screws have pulled up the threads, the re-tapping of mullered threads in things, welding back up trashed cases and the list goes on. I also often fit a new clutch cover (banshee is about 100 new) and sometimes an uprated water pump another 40ish with a drain plate, 60. The list just goes on... and weve not started on reeds/rubbers/carbs yet.
Ok, maybe stuff is more trashed in Aus... I have a ypvs in my shed right now with 80,000kms on it, I imagine thats going to need a vast amount of work on its motor... Ive not even turned it over, its not actually mine so I wont.
Anyway, I gave up counting when I went over a grand... but I do buy a lot of OEM parts and replace lots of stuff. If i was doing that job for someone else Id have either lost time or charged for cleaning up the shitty spoogy motor, pull it apart (I spent an hour yesterday just fighting to remove the 8 ypvs base nuts as they were rounded off and trashed, only had to cut one off, but wow it took ages), work out what was needed and then order the parts from multiple suppliers online and locally, drive about to drop stuff at platers and reborers etc and then build it all back up. If i were a business I wouldnt charge 'storage time' while the parts were shipped, but every hour you spend when youre in business is an hour you either charge for or dont get paid, Im not in business with this so its ok, but Id expect any business to charge me etc.
I expect people reading this are thinking one of 2 things: 1, Jons an ass-hole who would charge a bunch for any work, I really wouldnt want him to build me a motor it would cost a packet... well, thats lucky as I dont do work for other people. 2, Id like to buy one of Jon's bikes when he sells it, he does loads to his motors and fits lots of good parts
Anyway, as I said Im not knocking your costings if they work for you then thats great, but when I do this kind of work it sure costs me more than 600quid and thats without the hours spent sourcing and doing the work as my time is my own, its my motor etc.
Please, let's not get too hung up on this, some guy says he paid 14k to restore his bike and he may even have bills for 14k. Doesnt mean he wasnt ripped off, doesnt mean he was. with the price of nos parts and natty back-in-the-day aftermarkets parts like pipes, seats, rearsets, pro am kits etc and new uprated parts like cyl heads and carbon parts costing a small packet you could easily spend a bunch on one of these. Sometimes you dont have to, sometimes you must if stuff is trashed, and sometimes you might already have bits from another project. Would I spend 14k to someone else to do one, nope. Id do my own, but not everyone can I guess.
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WTF???
Oct 20, 2017 6:50:11 GMT 1
via mobile
Post by earthman on Oct 20, 2017 6:50:11 GMT 1
I watch a fair few vehicle restoration programmes, there's no doubt that parts and labour costs mount up, the owner of Fantom Works tried to tell one owner that his car would never be worth more than 20k even after sinking 75k into it. Yes, he still had them restore the vehicle.
My guess is that those customers are few and far between, I dunno but with the cost of premises, staff etc, it must be hard to run as a business?
For the average 'Man in a shed' who builds these in their spare time, it's more about enjoyment/passing the time than hoping to sell for a figure that most potential owners would (or could even) afford to pay for an old vehicle??
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WTF???
Oct 20, 2017 7:54:33 GMT 1
Post by dusty350 on Oct 20, 2017 7:54:33 GMT 1
My Lc engine rebuild = £1000 My Ypvs engine rebuild =£1200. If you use genuine Yam parts where possible, crank, rebore, vapour blast cases and powdercoat outer cases, that's easily the price you'll pay, doing as much yourself too. Dusty
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WTF???
Oct 20, 2017 9:59:39 GMT 1
via mobile
Post by wassy on Oct 20, 2017 9:59:39 GMT 1
I was looking for an N1 or 2 for ages and was tempted by a couple of projects that came up but I knew that I would get halfway through and get distracted / lose interest / run out of time etc so when Yogi's N1 came up for sale I bought it unseen and had it delivered by Mike. I've been using it and am happy with it. Had I bought a project it would still be in bits ...... I can't see that a restored 4L0 is worth eight grand more than my bike but everyone is different.
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Post by dusty350 on Oct 20, 2017 11:11:00 GMT 1
I wouldn't take too much notice of that Lc's "value"!! Even with the prices that good bikes fetch, there's something wrong with that ! And you got a bargain with Yogi's pv - really lovely bike Dusty
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WTF???
Oct 20, 2017 11:40:54 GMT 1
Post by sbscnor on Oct 20, 2017 11:40:54 GMT 1
The first LC I ever restored was 10 years ago, I kept EVERY receipt for the spares or services I bought then I sat down one evening and worked out how much I had spent I stopped counting at £4.132.96 and still had more to go. This does NOT include the hours I spent in the workshop, cleaning parts, the hours spent searching Ebay for parts, and the cost of petrol taking parts for work to be done.
Looking at the rise in price of LC spares now would I do a restore to original NO because I don't think I could afford to, is an LC worth the ££ currently being asked on Ebay NO but I would still buy one YES in a heart beat if I could find one that was right for me.
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