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Post by deanok1969 on Jul 25, 2020 14:07:54 GMT 1
Hello Forum, Afraid i am reaching out to you for advice again. The debacle with my YPVS N1 overheating is not cured...I thought the thermostat had solved it but to no avail. So far i have: 1. Checked the water pump drive and impeller - all good 2. Replaced the thermostat and new coolant 3. Fitted a new ally radiator 4. Checked the intake due to previous owner allowing the air filter to disintegrate 5. Cleaned/checked carbs 6. Fitted new air filer, BR9ES plugs and caps The plugs are running a light brown - not sure if too lean but if i was would it not only cause overheating if ridden hard? I have been b11sh1tted by the last owner - he clearly never maintained the bike. You all tried to help me indentify the pipes on the bike - could it be it was never jetted to suit - again back to the question if that would only affect the temp when under high loads? The bike seems to run fine, i can leave it idling and watch the temperature rise, see the stat open and get a temporary reduction in temp then it rises up towards the red and i switch off before it gets there - same symptoms when ridden ( and i only take it gently whilst trying to solve this). Really clutching at straws now.... Dean.
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Post by midlifecrisisrd on Jul 25, 2020 14:13:25 GMT 1
What happens to the temp if riding at say 40mph?
Steve
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Post by deanok1969 on Jul 25, 2020 14:16:12 GMT 1
Hi Steve,
There seems to be no pattern. I took a 20 mile ride out the other day and it seemed to stay around mid-gauge for around 15 miles and then whilst still on the move seems to creep up again...
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Post by flames on Jul 25, 2020 15:12:15 GMT 1
Is it worth checking the temperature by another means to check whether the temperature is actually rising. May be an issue with the sender or guage?
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Post by flames on Jul 25, 2020 15:14:40 GMT 1
What about rad cap? Is it opening to release pressure as temp rises.
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Post by deanok1969 on Jul 25, 2020 15:22:21 GMT 1
Hi again,
I have not noticed the rad cap lifting but had the feeling i had switched off before it came to that - i would assume this only happens if it boils right up? I did think the sender may be the issue but it seems to behave normally. It moves throughout the range normally and seems to climb steadily as the bike first warms up and adjusts as the stat appears to open as the bike warms up. I guess for £20 or so for a sender it is worth eliminating.
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Post by midlifecrisisrd on Jul 25, 2020 15:28:40 GMT 1
It's unusual it behaves sometimes
Think I'd want a cheap digital gauge on there to see what it is actually doing
I think if the rad cap was opening too early would it not be bubbling the expansion tank
Steve
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Post by deanok1969 on Jul 25, 2020 15:42:56 GMT 1
Cheers again guys.
I see Norbo does an analogue gauge for £45 - anyone tried one? I guess with a digital one i would have to faff around getting 12v to it or are they battery powered versions?
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Post by mouse on Jul 25, 2020 15:58:38 GMT 1
There are battery powered temp gauges, hope this link works trailtechproducts.co.uk/acatalog/Hour_Meter.htmlI use these on my hybrids, they are excellent, very neat and small. I plumbed it in to the hose from the head to the rad as that is where the water is coming out of the engine. Obviously you need to cut the hose and insert the sender, i think you need the 25mm sender and a couple more jubilee clips. HTH Mouse
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Post by tacky1 on Jul 25, 2020 16:00:53 GMT 1
I had the same problem with one of my bikes, Swapped every part know to man, Even fitted a high flow impellor, Always boiled over when pushed a bit, Turned out it was my head, The previous owner machined the head to run race gas, The squish was too tight, Sent out the head and had the squish modded to 1mm and never looked back, Has your head been skimmed or machined... Maybe running aftermarket pistons that have a slightly different crown height, That would tighten up the squish. Is you head gasket OEM or aftermarket, Could be that also, I would run an OEM basket with a little bit of copper spray.
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Post by flames on Jul 25, 2020 16:00:55 GMT 1
Hi again, I have not noticed the rad cap lifting but had the feeling i had switched off before it came to that - i would assume this only happens if it boils right up? I did think the sender may be the issue but it seems to behave normally. It moves throughout the range normally and seems to climb steadily as the bike first warms up and adjusts as the stat appears to open as the bike warms up. I guess for £20 or so for a sender it is worth eliminating. Don't think you would see the cap lifting. It would be the springy bit inside that lifts to allow the expanded water release back to the tank.if it doesn't release you get a pressure build up. You could try an instant read thermometer for cheapness to test water temp. It would give you an indication whether it is overheating without wireing something in. I would go for 10 min ride, then when back let idle to the point temp starts creeping up and with some rag twist rad cap to release pressure, remove and test temp. Be careful when releasing pressure tho.
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Post by jessy03 on Jul 25, 2020 16:08:09 GMT 1
I had something similar a few years back, it turned out to be my head gasket. Jess
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Post by deanok1969 on Jul 25, 2020 16:08:43 GMT 1
OK, thanks guys. I really don't think any modifications have ever been done other than the pipes. I will try the temp gauge and then i guess it starts getting expensive - i just wish i knew the history of the bike and never believed the last owner - BTW he swears blind it never overheated in the 28 years he owned it.....
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Post by midlifecrisisrd on Jul 25, 2020 16:08:53 GMT 1
Cheers again guys. I see Norbo does an analogue gauge for £45 - anyone tried one? I guess with a digital one i would have to faff around getting 12v to it or are they battery powered versions? I have a battery koso one on my bike You can easily get 12v from the temp gauge Steve
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Post by deanok1969 on Jul 25, 2020 16:35:23 GMT 1
I had something similar a few years back, it turned out to be my head gasket. Jess Cheers Jess- covering all bases have ordered a new head gasket as well.
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Post by deanok1969 on Jul 25, 2020 16:51:15 GMT 1
I had the same problem with one of my bikes, Swapped every part know to man, Even fitted a high flow impellor, Always boiled over when pushed a bit, Turned out it was my head, The previous owner machined the head to run race gas, The squish was too tight, Sent out the head and had the squish modded to 1mm and never looked back, Has your head been skimmed or machined... Maybe running aftermarket pistons that have a slightly different crown height, That would tighten up the squish. Is you head gasket OEM or aftermarket, Could be that also, I would run an OEM basket with a little bit of copper spray.
I have ordered a head gasket from e-bay. It shows original in the Yam packaging - would you only recommend OEM for head gaskets on the YPVS or LCs in general?
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Post by flames on Jul 25, 2020 16:59:18 GMT 1
Can't go wrong with gen yamaha. Athena seem to be popular choice also , looking at other posts today.
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Post by midlifecrisisrd on Jul 25, 2020 17:21:20 GMT 1
I have used pattern a couple of times and they were ok but my choice would always be genuine
You ideally need to change the base gaskets too as I'd always recommend torquing the head bolts with just the base nuts finger tight Then tighten the base nuts
Steve
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Post by deanok1969 on Jul 25, 2020 17:42:14 GMT 1
On a happier note, i just fitted one of Norbo's polished alloy fork braces - it looks the business compared to the original corroded old bit of plate that was lingering there
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Post by st66 on Jul 25, 2020 19:08:46 GMT 1
. Well may I,, make a suggestion,, I have an app on my phone which is like a thermal camera just like the firebrigade use kind of thing it registers heat in colours ect,,, just point your phone at it via the camera and bobs your uncle may be useful to show where the heat starts to build up, and will check your cooling system on the off chance there's a restriction or blockage say in the rad or something,, just a thought I use it all the time at work it gives a picture and temp ect very usefull,, 👍
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Post by deanok1969 on Jul 25, 2020 19:23:21 GMT 1
Hi, great idea. I actually have access to a thermal imaging camera used for industrial maintenance purposes (well my old employer had one) which i am certain i could borrow but will try the app first as per your suggestion. Joining this forum is the best thing i ever did!
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Post by mak595 on Jul 25, 2020 19:51:34 GMT 1
Is it pressuring the header tank? Think I'd be looking at head gasket/warped head.....
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Post by steeley on Jul 25, 2020 20:57:02 GMT 1
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Post by deanok1969 on Jul 26, 2020 10:00:39 GMT 1
Thanks for the further advice guys. I have a head gasket on route and will order a set of hoses from Norbo as meant to get them for the new rad. I think the hose set includes the bypass pipe so will change it by virtue of the new hoses.
I am not sure if it is pressurising the header tank, i will run it up this morning to determine.
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Post by Shytalk on Jul 26, 2020 10:11:56 GMT 1
That’s a lot of parts gone through with no result, is it actually overheating or is the sender / gauge temperamental?
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Post by deanok1969 on Jul 26, 2020 12:32:23 GMT 1
I have got a new sender on the way. To be honest many of things i have changed were going to get done for cosmetic reasons anyway (i.e. the rad & hoses looked cr@ppy etc.
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Post by marrcel on Jul 27, 2020 17:58:03 GMT 1
In your opening post you suggest that jetting can be off due to exhausts. Are they changed on the bike? I had overheating issues at 6krpm 6th gear 0,25 throttle opening. It was too lean on the needle.
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Post by deanok1969 on Jul 27, 2020 20:06:50 GMT 1
Hi and thanks for the advice.
The last owner (who had the bike 28 years) swears to me it has never overheated before. It has barely been ridden in the last 10 years if the mileage on the MOT's etc. is too be believed. This is steering me away from carburation etc. as although i can see he was no maestro when it comes to maintenance, he doesn't seem the type to lie - he just seems a bit dim. The forum advised on pipes by the images i put up and seem to arrived at the suggestion that they are probably Nikkon - these have been on the bike many years (although in my previous days as an owner (last YPVS in 1997) i cannot remember them being an option?) so would assume if they were the root cause it would have manifested long before now? The guys on here have rightly suggested the importance of checking that it really is hot - i am an electrical engineer by trade with many years working on instrumentation and although i have not performed any tests, the linear way in which the gauge behaves in both directions leads me to believe it is not a measurement error - but i will check it on Wednesday anyway (the sender for resistance in hot water and the gauge with a decade box to match the recommended resistances from the sender). If no luck then I guess I start thinking about carburation or the other advice to check the head/gasket for warping or pressurisation. Can anyone advise a simple test for pressurisation of the cooling system? I guess i need to run it up to high temp and get the tank off quick?
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avb
Thrash Merchant
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Posts: 385
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Post by avb on Jul 27, 2020 20:18:55 GMT 1
just take the left hand infill panel off and swing the coolant overflow tank out no need to remove gas tank
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Post by midlifecrisisrd on Jul 27, 2020 20:48:47 GMT 1
Usually if the gasket has gone it will make the expansion tank bubble over so you would notice coolant on the LHS of the engine below the tank
Steve
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